Question about JFK runway use??

[Delta777LR]

Why is it when JFK uses Runway 31R for landings and Runway 31L for take offs and landings,, Why is it that they always switch to either runways 22s or 4s every early evenings??

[Lezam]

In addition, why are the 4's used alot in the early mornings?

[PhilDernerJr]

Just my own guess, but I think the morning is when there are red-eye arrivals from the west, and rwy 4 saves fuel on that "right-in" approach.

Same with 22 arrivals with the afternoon rush of international arrivals from over the Atlantic.

[lijk604]

Not to mention, the 4 arrivals are probably the most noise-friendly of all the configs, thereby not waking folks up at 4am with a 31R/L or 22L approach. Now if winds dictate sure they'll land 31L @ 3am, but if they dont have to, the aiport wants to be a good neighbor and keeps the noise over the ocean.

[Lezam]

Not to mention, the 4 arrivals are probably the most noise-friendly of all the configs, thereby not waking folks up at 4am with a 31R/L or 22L approach. Now if winds dictate sure they'll land 31L @ 3am, but if they dont have to, the aiport wants to be a good neighbor and keeps the noise over the ocean.

Never thought of that, good point. Ive never gotten woken up by all the heavies even though theyre only a few thousand feet away. :?

[Delta777LR]

I always thought that as taking pictures of 31L departures, There is not alot of chances to catch airlines like Air China, Air India or even some european take offs because the airport switches runways at a curtain time and for me, since I take public transportation, I have a hard time getting to areas near runways 22 and 4 to catch those planes in time espeacial that im not aware of when runway operations are switched...

[kc2aqg]

"Ooh ooh pick me Mr. Kotter, pick me!!!"

I know the answer to this one and found this out way back when JFKTower was a happening board. Back in the 90's and early 2000's, in addition to the regular flight path noise abatement plans (immediate left turn off of 31L, special immediate turn departures off of 31R, VOR 13L approach instead of straight-in), flight paths were also partially controlled by time. Back when traffic was pretty light at JFK, especially during the off hours, JFK used to start the day on the 4's or 22's. Towards the early afternoon when traffic was picking up for the internationals, they would switch to 13/31's and stay on that until the evening. When evening would come, they would switch back to 4/22's. This would vary the traffic flow over the various neighborhoods.

NOTE: This is not an exact description and I'm sure this plan wasn't always followed, but you get the idea. I am thinking that this plan isn't still in effect since the major boom of traffic at JFK, but perhaps a variation of it is still in use.

[moose135]

One of the major reasons they switch to 22L/R in the late afternoon/evening is the amount of departures - for various reasons, when on 13 or 31, they only use one runway for departures. When the evening rush starts up, they often switch to 22, and send departures off both Left and Right. When we had those strong NW winds for several days a few weeks ago, they couldn't make the changeover. Listening to the scanner while spotting, tower mentioned frequently that they were restricted to one-runway ops for departures, and asked everyone to be ready to go when called.

[Delta777LR]

One of the major reasons they switch to 22L/R in the late afternoon/evening is the amount of departures - for various reasons, when on 13 or 31, they only use one runway for departures. When the evening rush starts up, they often switch to 22, and send departures off both Left and Right. When we had those strong NW winds for several days a few weeks ago, they couldn't make the changeover. Listening to the scanner while spotting, tower mentioned frequently that they were restricted to one-runway ops for departures, and asked everyone to be ready to go when called.

How can I get a scanner to listen for the tower if I wanted one Moose... What you are saying is very true but I dont think I have any access of getting one

[PhilDernerJr]

Radio Shack. $100.

[Delta777LR]

what would the chanell be for the tower Phil, im going to take this down

[adam613]

119.1

You can also listen online:

http://audio.liveatc.net:8012/kjfk_twr.m3u

Prepare to get addicted...

[pgengler]

123.9 is the other frequency sometimes used for tower; if they're using both freqs it'll usually be one for each runway. It's also worth getting the frequencies for Approach and Final (I have them in my scanner, but have no idea which of the dozen or so "NY Approach" freqs are the right ones) so that you can get a little more heads up on what's going on. When they change runways, they'll have a few established for one config when they start vectoring for the new one, so if you're listening you get a couple of minutes notice, though not enough to get from one spot to another, even with a car.

[kc2aqg]

FYI as far as airport info and relevant frequencies go: http://www.airnav.com/airport/KJFK

Airnav is a great resource for any airport or navaid info. Also, that liveATC feed is extremely addictive!

[Delta777LR]

Thanks for the help guys... Im going to try to save up for a scanner... because right now my SLR should be delivered to me very soon and with the scanner to use, ill will resume taking pictures again..