Video: PIO The best example

**Derf** · 2012-03-20, 08:58 PM

Can you say WTF was the pilot thinking!?!?!?

**steve1840** · 2012-03-20, 09:26 PM

OMG!!! I would have hated to be in that cabin!

**threeholerglory** · 2012-03-20, 09:45 PM

at least they're current now...

**gonzalu** · 2012-03-20, 11:02 PM

Fred, how do you know what happened? For all we know, they could have had a perfectly fine ride down and then something could have happened last minute... how many times you go out in your car and someone cuts you off? Do you abort each time? How do you predict everything that's going to happen? It looked fine up until the very last minute!

**seahawks7757** · 2012-03-21, 01:18 AM

I would have loved to been on that!

**snydersnapshots** · 2012-03-21, 09:44 AM

Originally Posted by gonzalu

Fred, how do you know what happened? For all we know, they could have had a perfectly fine ride down and then something could have happened last minute... how many times you go out in your car and someone cuts you off? Do you abort each time? How do you predict everything that's going to happen? It looked fine up until the very last minute!

Hello from a newbie to the forum. I'm not Fred, but I do have a little time in the pointy end of high-speed aluminum tubing, so I'll give it my best guess here.

Like you said, the approach looked good but it all came apart in the flare. My initial thought was wake turbulence, but after looking at the video a few more times, I think he flared too high and started floating. Not realizing how high he was, he started feeling for the ground by adding a little aileron (If you're 6" or a foot off the ground, this will get the gear on the runway with a minimum amount of fuss). As he slowed, the wing dropped because of the loss of lift caused by the low airspeed and raised spoilers on that side. Once that wing dropped, he countered with opposite aileron. The right wing regained the lift and the left wing dropped because of the spoilers on that side. About that time, the airplane fell out from under him and he pulled back to arrest the sink. He hit and the airplane bounced but didn't have enough airspeed to really fly, so the nose came down. I'm thinking when the airplane got to the gate it received a hard landing inspection and at least two new seat cushions in the cockpit...

The best option to avoid being put on YouTube (or worse--CNN) would have been to go around. Having said that, sometimes you get focused on landing instead of going around. Sometimes you've been flying for twelve hours and really don't want to do another 20 minutes, so you try to make it work. Sometimes pride gets involved and you don't want to admit you screwed up. Every pilot, whether in a small airplane or a jet, has taxied in thinking "Whew. I probably should have gone around out of that one..."

**Derf** · 2012-03-21, 10:17 AM

I was just going to say Manny....Bite me....but I like what you said! ;)

Seriously....that was almost a crash..... That was a bad case of PIO, I do not care about the approach, he almost bit it there! In PIO, it usually happens when the airplane is very slow. The correct way to get out of this is POWER. They should have never had let this go on as long as it did without adding power... By the time the engine spools up they may be out of the event...or it may get them out of the event. This was like said in the post above, roll spoilers spoiling the air of the wing that is barley flying to begin with. Watch Your IAS!

**Derf** · 2012-03-21, 10:27 AM

to prove Manny's point, here is a verified excellent pilot

**PhilDernerJr** · 2012-03-21, 10:47 AM

snydersnapshots, welcome! Great feedback for a great first post. :)

**PhilDernerJr** · 2012-03-21, 10:49 AM

Originally Posted by Derf

to prove Manny's point, here is a verified excellent pilot

Yeah, looks like the shuttle did just what you prescribed...added power. ;)

**snydersnapshots** · 2012-03-21, 11:01 AM

Originally Posted by Derf

That was a bad case of PIO, ... Watch Your IAS!

You, my friend, are the master of understatement...

I was trying to figure out why a pilot would let the airplane go that far. The guy flared high and didn't appear to even try to go around. Here is the scenario I came up with:

Perhaps the pilot transitioned from the 747 to the 777 recently. In the 747 he sat higher and was used to seeing a slightly different picture on landing--it would probably be one that leads to a high flare in a 777. So the guy has been flying for 10 or 12 hours. He's tired. He doesn't have enough time in the 777 for that sight picture to seem "normal" to him on landing, so he falls back on the familiar habit pattern. This leads to a high flare and the float. In his mind, he's only a foot or so off the ground, so he feels for it by dropping the wing, and the rest is history.

As a flight instructor, some of the scariest pilots to fly with were airline pilots who hadn't been in a light plane for several years. They all tried to flare at 50 feet when 3 feet is normal...