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Thread: Getting used to us

  1. #1
    Senior Member hiss srq's Avatar
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    Getting used to us

    A few nights ago on the way out the doors late in the evening a pair of USNG troops stopped me on the way out the door to point out a suspicious baggie they had found on the floor in the terminal and we got to talking a little bit about various security issues plaugeing the industry to this date and during the course of the conversation the topic of aviation photography came about.

    The lady as there was a male and a female brought up as one councern as we talked that she had a few days ago spotted a "suspicious" fellow down by the glass between the shuttle mainline councourse in the USAir terminal snapping up pics of some of the planes and she felt this was a concern and outside of rules. Right away without controlling myself I began to laugh a bit and she gave me a look like what is wrong with you? Once I releived myself of that chuckle I began to explain to her about it and that it was infact not what I would deem a threat to aviation. I began to explain to her that this is infact a major hobby across the world and in many other places a welcome and endorsed activity by even the airport authority. I did understand where she was coming from though in that she might be a little edgy. I myself when I spot people snapping pics inside the airport tend to approach the individual and try to "feel them out" at work when I happen upon it. Generally I approach in a non threatening manner (duh) and try to ask them their intention in a sort of off the line manner. I usually will aproach them and say something along the lines of "isn't the airbus a beaut?" or maybe toss a refrence to Airliners.net in there. Generally if they seem to get the drift it leads into a good spotting conversation.

    Back on track, at first they had a hard time understanding it all but I refrenced NYCAviation and showed them the card I have from the group and began to explain in detail about it and that I agree with them to a certain point. They were very receptive to this and I also aknowladge the fact that they still needed to be vigilant and I endorse it 100% as if they did not ask at least I would be more concerned.

    I have even built a reputation with the PAPD and a pretty decent acceptance from most officers about it. Several people in the PAPD are even familiar with anet and our site actually without my introduction. I really walked away from the discussion feeling good and I think they appreciated the fact that I took the time to talk to them about it. I certainly appreciated their receptiveness to everything.

    I just wanted to share that experince.
    Southwest Airlines-"Once it pop's it's time to stop" Southwest Airlines-"Our Shamu's are almost real" Southwest Airlines -"We blow our top real easy" Southwest Airlines- "You can't top us..... really"

  2. #2
    Senior Member nikon50bigma's Avatar
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    Re: Getting used to us

    Thats good to hear, that they are getting used to us spotters.
    Theres a group card for nycaviation?
    Patrick O --- Staten Island, NY

  3. #3
    Senior Member hiss srq's Avatar
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    Re: Getting used to us

    The post card
    Southwest Airlines-"Once it pop's it's time to stop" Southwest Airlines-"Our Shamu's are almost real" Southwest Airlines -"We blow our top real easy" Southwest Airlines- "You can't top us..... really"

  4. #4
    Administrator PhilDernerJr's Avatar
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    Re: Getting used to us

    We have 4x6 promo cards for the site, that have Josh Akbar's Delta 762 photo from Planeview on the front. I'll give you one bigma the next time I see you.
    Email me anytime at [email protected].

  5. #5
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    Re: Getting used to us

    Those postcards are very helpful, I probably hand one out once a week.


    Eric
    It's hard to take chances but sometimes it's better if you do

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  6. #6
    Senior Member NIKV69's Avatar
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    Re: Getting used to us

    we got to talking a little bit about various security issues plaugeing the industry to this date and during the course of the conversation the topic of aviation photography came about.
    How does someone taking pics of planes enter into a conversation about problems with commercial aviation security?

    at first they had a hard time understanding it all
    As am I the more I read.

    I also aknowladge the fact that they still needed to be vigilant and I endorse it 100%
    No brainer here. I love the fact that people pick up the phone when they see someone they honestly feel is suspicious. A professional officer of any agency will check our ID and make sure we are not a threat and go about his business. It's an easy equation.

    I was talking to Dave Budd about the differences between the NY area airports and LAS. Part of the treat of shooting out west is the fact that you can shoot without the stuff we deal with sometimes in NY. Though I feel it's improving somewhat. I think what most LO wants is not to deal with the phone calls they get. Some feel if they can scare with the "What you are doing is illegal" routine is they can eventually run us all off. Either way for the most part NY is a little more sensitive since we have been attacked and remain one of the prime targets. It's just natural that we would be more scrutinized. The post cards are great but I think they know who we are by now and are just trying to keep people calm. I love the reaction of Tommy's buddy at the mounds as soon as he saw us. It was priceless but serves as a reminder of how some react.
    'My idea of a good picture is one that's in focus and of a famous person doing something unfamous.' Andy Warhol

  7. #7
    Senior Member hiss srq's Avatar
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    Re: Getting used to us

    It entered in because they brought it up to me. That is all. We discussed it and I layed out the hobby, refrenced the web sites, whipped the card out and that was that.
    Southwest Airlines-"Once it pop's it's time to stop" Southwest Airlines-"Our Shamu's are almost real" Southwest Airlines -"We blow our top real easy" Southwest Airlines- "You can't top us..... really"

  8. #8
    Senior Member moose135's Avatar
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    Re: Getting used to us

    Quote Originally Posted by hiss srq
    It entered in because they brought it up to me. That is all. We discussed it and I layed out the hobby, refrenced the web sites, whipped the card out and that was that.
    Be careful about what you whip out in an airport

  9. #9
    Senior Member NIKV69's Avatar
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    Re: Getting used to us

    It entered in because they brought it up to me.
    Can you clarify a bit. I mean I still fail to see how someone who has a camera is any problem to any agency protecting airports and aircraft. Did they give you any examples?
    'My idea of a good picture is one that's in focus and of a famous person doing something unfamous.' Andy Warhol

  10. #10
    Administrator PhilDernerJr's Avatar
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    Re: Getting used to us

    Nick, there are hundreds of ways it could have come up. Why are you assuming that there was any implications that the guard mentioned it because hiss was deemed a threat?

    The guard could have said "unfortunately, some others in my position find photography to be a problem," which would not be wrong.

    Nothing wrong happened here, but you just need to start trouble.
    Email me anytime at [email protected].

  11. #11
    Senior Member NIKV69's Avatar
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    Re: Getting used to us

    Nothing wrong happened here, but you just need to start trouble.
    Why am I asking for trouble? I am asking for some clarity for a somewhat (if not totally) confusing post. I just fail to see how two National guard people would pull aviation photography out of the air when discussing national security. Especially when there is no examples given. I know you have fallen in love with this thread since you have found yet another ave to plug your site but as someone who particpates in discussions here I like to stay on the topic at hand. My question was directed at Ryan not you.
    'My idea of a good picture is one that's in focus and of a famous person doing something unfamous.' Andy Warhol

  12. #12
    Administrator PhilDernerJr's Avatar
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    Re: Getting used to us

    Quote Originally Posted by NIKV69
    Why am I asking for trouble? I am asking for some clarity for a somewhat (if not totally) confusing post. I just fail to see how two National guard people would pull aviation photography out of the air when discussing national security.
    Security being what the guards do, and aviation photography is what hiss does. It's called conversation, and it usually go back and forth talking about each others' interests.

    Quote Originally Posted by NIKV69
    I know you have fallen in love with this thread since you have found yet another ave to plug your site but as someone who particpates in discussions here I like to stay on the topic at hand. My question was directed at Ryan not you.
    What other avenue? The promo cards? They are almost 2 years old and have nothing to do with this. Or is this an example of your standard diversionary tactic when your arguments are completely baseless?

    I responded because you take any non-issue and try to crate some "our rights are being trampled" sentiment. I wasn't trying to answer, but point out that hiss was posting something positive, which you nitpicked to death.

    If you don't want others to respond, then use PMs.
    Email me anytime at [email protected].

  13. #13
    Senior Member emshighway's Avatar
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    Re: Getting used to us

    Yes, someone photographing areas in the airport can be a cause for alarm since it has been proved numerous times that terrorist scout out their targets. The National Guard has the authority to check a possible suspicious action out. If they talk to the person and all works out then it isn't a suspicious incident.

    If I see someone standing in an area for an extended period of time and appears to be observing I may go over and ask if they need assistance and feel out what they are doing. It may be totally harmless or lead to something suspicious, it is how they answer that determines this. If you were to answer me "It is my right and why are you trampling my rights" then I will think you are over reacting to compensate for something.

    Just like the FlyerWhiners on another site you don't help yourself by jumping to the wrong conclusion and jumping on your soapbox. This does not lend to other people being receptive to you.

    Remember LGA, JFK & EWR are run by an authority and technically by such can be deemed private property. You do not have a right to do what ever you want in these areas.

    You may want to play advocate and jump up and down but in these cases the squeaky wheel doesn't get the grease, It get put outside the fence.

    I think Hiss did exactly right and used education to better the cause.
    "The nine most terrifying words in the English language are, 'I'm from the government and I'm here to help.' "
    Ronald Reagan

  14. #14
    Senior Member NIKV69's Avatar
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    Re: Getting used to us

    The promo cards? They are almost 2 years old and have nothing to do with this
    Well you guys are the ones who brought the cards into the discussion. Not me.

    Or is this an example of your standard diversionary tactic when your arguments are completely baseless?
    Whats baseless is how anyone involved in LO discussing problems plagueing the industry involving security would bring av-photo up. It makes no sense. Apart from an officer having to invest 10 mins of his time checking us out you will have to point out how. Yet nobody has.

    If you don't want others to respond, then use PMs.
    Phil why would I want to use PMs? The thread has been started and people are discussing it. Just because it's not a love fest doesn't give you the right to attack me or anyone who asks the thread starter questions. If I broke a rule then moderate it. If not let us talk. Ryan is a big boy I am sure he can handle it.


    Yes, someone photographing areas in the airport can be a cause for alarm since it has been proved numerous times that terrorist scout out their targets. The National Guard has the authority to check a possible suspicious action out. If they talk to the person and all works out then it isn't a suspicious incident.
    100% correct. Like I said it's an easy equation. Someone looks suspicious they get checked out. LO is doing their job, we are enjoying liberties bestowed upon us by this country. Why is it a problem plagueing the industry?


    Remember LGA, JFK & EWR are run by an authority and technically by such can be deemed private property. You do not have a right to do what ever you want in these areas.
    Again you are stating something we have discussed a million times before and we know. I am not asking about that. I am merely trying to understand why a USNG individual would bring up av-photo as an example as a problem.
    'My idea of a good picture is one that's in focus and of a famous person doing something unfamous.' Andy Warhol

  15. #15
    Administrator PhilDernerJr's Avatar
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    Re: Getting used to us

    Quote Originally Posted by NIKV69
    Well you guys are the ones who brought the cards into the discussion. Not me.
    Do you read? I didn't bring anything up. The promo cards were a part of the original post. All I did was explain what it was when someone asked. I didn't show any pleasure towards its use in the way it was used, and that is a HUGE assumption on your part.

    Quote Originally Posted by NIKV69
    Whats baseless is how anyone involved in LO discussing problems plagueing the industry involving security would bring av-photo up. It makes no sense. Apart from an officer having to invest 10 mins of his time checking us out you will have to point out how. Yet nobody has.
    You're making the assumption that the guard was complaining about av photography. It wasn't even the point of the post....are you grasping that? Are you even able to grasp that? That's what baseless is. Those details weren't mentioned because there was no problem there. Things come up in conversation millions of ways, but you need to overanalyze and find problems to bring up out of nowhere.

    Quote Originally Posted by NIKV69
    Phil why would I want to use PMs? The thread has been started and people are discussing it. Just because it's not a love fest doesn't give you the right to attack me or anyone who asks the thread starter questions. If I broke a rule then moderate it. If not let us talk. Ryan is a big boy I am sure he can handle it.
    Why use PMs? Seriously, do you read what YOU say that I am responding to? I was answering your question. You said that you were asking Ryan a question and not me, so I explained why I replied, and that if you had a question solely for hiss for no one else to reply to, to use PM. All you did here was act as though I explained that for no reason. An excellent example of the circles you try to create in conversation. It's shocking and sad.

    As for the love fest, you brought up a sensitive topic of Law Enforcement with aviation photography in a negative light when there wasn't any reason for it, and I responded with similar passion. You act as though my comments were out of left field, when yours were what came from nowhere....since there was not a problem in what hiss posted to begin with.....since it was a POSITIVE experience.

    Attacking you? Are you going to act as though you weren't being aggressive in your post towards me? Why are you trying to play the victim, contradicting yourself from your previous posts?

    Nick, when I hang out with you, I have a great time. Your humor is off-the-wall, and therefore up my alley, but your politics and discussion on actual topics is downright frightening. You can't seem to stay on a topic, discuss it through, and you just like to attempt to make progress by creating confusing and going against what everyone else says just for the sake doing so.

    Aviation enthusiasm is a hobby that has so many different ways of enjoying and practicing it. However, as expansive as it is, you still seem to be so bored as to nitpick posts and find unnecessary debate where there shouldn't be any. It is most unfortunate that you've become the cat lady of the boards, hopelessly trying to create drama wherever you can for no apparent reason.

    Quote Originally Posted by NIKV69
    I am merely trying to understand why a USNG individual would bring up av-photo as an example as a problem.
    *sigh* Hopeless.
    Email me anytime at [email protected].

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