World's Fair Marina 8/13

[AirtrafficController]

Went out to the Marina for some 31 arrivals and banking shots. Need help on editing.

http://i171.photobucket.com/albums/u317/AirtrafficController/008ab.jpg
http://i171.photobucket.com/albums/u317/AirtrafficController/010ab.jpg
http://i171.photobucket.com/albums/u317/AirtrafficController/011ab.jpg
http://i171.photobucket.com/albums/u317/AirtrafficController/012ab.jpg
http://i171.photobucket.com/albums/u317/AirtrafficController/020ab.jpg
http://i171.photobucket.com/albums/u317/AirtrafficController/022an.jpg
http://i171.photobucket.com/albums/u317/AirtrafficController/025-5.jpg

Got the Dash-8 in new colors:
http://i171.photobucket.com/albums/u317/AirtrafficController/044ab.jpg

http://i171.photobucket.com/albums/u317/AirtrafficController/049ab.jpg
http://i171.photobucket.com/albums/u317/AirtrafficController/054ab.jpg
http://i171.photobucket.com/albums/u317/AirtrafficController/048-1.jpg

[nwafan20]

Well, first off:

Your F stop is too large, your ISO is OK at 200, but try to leave it at 100. You want your shutter speed 2x your focal length (so 1/600th)

And the final problem, you got a sucky lens. the 70-300 (non-IS) is a horrible lens....

[Iberia A340-600]

Are we a little harsh today, Matty? :wink:

Some nice catches there Luke, if you need help with editing send me some of the pics you want edited and I'll see what I can do.

[email protected]

[PhilDernerJr]

Yeah, little harsh indeed.

[nwafan20]

Haha, sorry about that. My bad. :)

[NIKV69]

Well, first off:

Your F stop is too large, your ISO is OK at 200, but try to leave it at 100. You want your shutter speed 2x your focal length (so 1/600th)

And the final problem, you got a sucky lens. the 70-300 (non-IS) is a horrible lens....



A bit harsh, but maybe some tough love. I thought part of the reason for boards like this was to post our work but to also improve?

What ever lens you are using you have to follow some basics. As far as ISO goes 100 is great but remember you will have to hold the camera very still, bumping it up to 200 in Good light is ok and no fear of grain. Don't exceed 200 tho. Keep the F stop around F8 and choose mode that lets the camera picks the shutter. As Matt said 1/600th or a little more will be good. You got blur issues on some of your shots. Be mindful of your settings, white balance is important too. Image Stabilization or Vibration reduction is great but getting as close as you did at the marina I don't think it's that important. When I am that close I use my 80-200 and it doesn't have it and my results are fine. You have to practice framing and holding that thing steady when you go to press the shutter. Get a good book on photography and experiment with different settings when you shoot. Just don't sit there between planes. Check your shots and data and histograms. Adjsut accordingly.

[Winglets747]

By any chance did you get a NW 757 coming in around 10:30 a.m.?

[AirtrafficController]

Thanks guys for the help and tips, really appreciate it. Plan to hit JFK this week for more practice.

By any chance did you get a NW 757 coming in around 10:30 a.m.?
I was at the marina from 3-5pm.

[hiss srq]

Cool stuff. When I squint my eyes the Midwest shot looks pretty good. Maybe it is the 48 hours without any sleep though. Well, back to minding the taxiway contruction.

[T-Bird76]

You know this is the second post in about a week where people are bashing other people's photos...What the heck is going on? I'm really surprised at the level of total disrespect I see lately. You know the first lens I started out with was a Tamron 70-300 and it cost me 129 bucks...you know why I got it because it was what I could afford at the time and I was just starting out. My first shots were similar to some of the other first timers shots here and nothing that would ever make a front page of even a high school newsletter. You have to start out somewhere and Airtraffic's shots show a great improvement over the first ones he shared with us. If you don't like how someone shoots then keep it to yourself or discuss it in private and not in the forum.

[NIKV69]

it cost me 129 bucks

Darn I wish I knew that when I bought my D70 I bought that lens from Celmer and it cost me more than that!

Tommy has a point, though I don't mind the harsh criticism. On anet I got it from JeffM and others and in the end it helped more than it hurt. Rmember what doesn't kill us makes us stronger. Ok there has been so much tension here I am bringing in the happy dance!

http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2004-12/905683/happydance.gifhttp://img.villagephotos.com/p/2004-12/905683/happydance.gifhttp://img.villagephotos.com/p/2004-12/905683/happydance.gifhttp://img.villagephotos.com/p/2004-12/905683/happydance.gif

[nwafan20]

Sorry for being a bit harsh...

[AirtrafficController]

Apology accepted

[emshighway]

Phil and others,
Why not set up a spotting training session? Pick a date and place and invite others such as ATC and share your knowledge and experience?

[PhilDernerJr]

We're actually creating something to help people learn and familiarize themselves with the hobby. Hang out though, might take a couple months. :(

[moose135]

Phil and others,
Why not set up a spotting training session? Pick a date and place and invite others such as ATC and share your knowledge and experience?

Not to step on anything Phil has in the works, but I think most of us more experienced folks are always willing to help out a newbie. It might not be a formal training session, but I don't have a problem getting together with someone and offering advice while out spotting. I just haven't been out much so far this summer, might have to take a ride out this weekend if the weather looks good. I'll be sure to post if I do.

[jakbar]

I think most of us more experienced folks are always willing to help out a newbie. It might not be a formal training session, but I don't have a problem getting together with someone and offering advice while out spotting.

I totally agree. Like many of the people who frequent these forums, I'm always happy to help others out, whether it be with the technical side of taking and editing pictures or something as easy as giving a ride to someone who doesn't have a car.

Josh

[PhilDernerJr]

Yes, that's what the community is all about. We have a large group of people that are always willing to help out, whether it's someone new to the hobby or someone visiting from out of town.

Btw, what I'm making is just some resources.

[nwafan20]

Yeah, I am more than willing to help out, I guess I just posted it when I wasn't in the best of moods.

[brontis5]

I think people on the site should support one another. Not everyone has the same background or access to high end photo equipment. It shows a decent amount of dedication to spotting if you go out snap some shots and even post them to the site. Someday I would really love to run into some of you guys out there while spotting. I have lived here for over a year now and have never run into anyone spotting or photographing planes out at JFK or LGA. I am no expert when it comes to photography and would really love some pointers from people with more experience while seeing some great planes, plus spotting is more fun with others. I might go out this Sunday so if anyone else is going out then please let me know.

[NIKV69]

IMO I think as individuals we need to do a bit more on our own. I mean how many noobs here have actually went and purchased a good book on photography? Or one of Photoshop? Couple of years ago I bought a book about photography, more so the Digital SLR by Rick Sammon and it was absolutely awesome. Rick is a real pro and his work is great. Each chapter was better than the last and I still use it all the time for reference. I also bought a great book on CS2 s well. I also get Popular photography and imaging every month and it also has great articles and how-tos on PS and digital photography. One month it had a great article on fixing pics in ACR. It was so informative and I learned a ton on just few pages. I think if spent some time when the clouds are out, reading and learning how these expensive pieces of precision cameras work in addition to how to get the most out of them we would see improvement. It sure beats just going out there and shooting away all the time. Also I see many newbies trying to take pictures that are way outside their skill level. Start out simple. Learn to frame the pic, whether it's on the ground or an arrival. Shoot with good light and don't try angles or motives that you can't pull off. When you have a good grasp of that and you can expose them and get everything else right and can edit them in PS then you can move on to tougher stuff.

[PhilDernerJr]

I'm looking through this month's issues of photo magazines to see where Nick pasted that from. There's way too much logic in that post.

However, I disagree somewhat. What would an example be for a photo that's "outside of one's skill level"?

You look at someone who might be new to this like airtrafficcontroller, for example. He may be very pleased with his photos, but might want to get tips from more experienced people on how to improve.

Learning about your camera from magazines and manuals and books is one thing, but there is little to learn about aviation photography from. That why these boards are here, as well as boards on many other sites as well.

[Mellyrose]

"Outside of one's skill level" might not be the best way to describe it, but it definitely makes sense to start out with the basics before jumping to higher levels of shooting. If you haven't perfecting (or even tried) framing a stationary subject, then I don't think you should skip to panning and zooming a fast moving object, hundreds or thousands of feet away.

We all get where we are, skill-wise, through studying, practice and diligence. There are no shortcuts, even with the support of a great community like NYCA.

Some good advice Nick.

[njgtr82]

I think a good book is a great thing to have. The first one I bought was digital slr's for dummies. It taught me alot of the basics about the camera, its settings, and basic photography itself(like Nick said with lighting, framing, etc.). Knowing your camera and what it does are some basics all should know. Every situation is different so your always using different settings.

[NIKV69]

What would an example be for a photo that's "outside of one's skill level"?


"Outside of one's skill level" might not be the best way to describe it,

Pretty self explanatory. Someone who can't take a normal side on, whether it's a 50mm stationary or an 150mm arrival shouldn't be trying close ups of moving aircraft or these weird angles. If thats what they want fine, but it doesn't good when it comes to improvement.


Learning about your camera from magazines and manuals and books is one thing, but there is little to learn about aviation photography from. That why these boards are here, as well as boards on many other sites as well.


Not to sound rude but I learned really nothing from the boards here or even on anet as far as actual photography. Editing and spotting flaws and why it happend yes but getting the actual capture. I learned through reading advice from professionals and practicing it in the field. If you truck out to the airport without a plan or without something you want to accomplish you are just going to sit there and point and shoot and go home and not know what you are looking at. If you learn about your camera, and settings and reading the histogram, exposure, lighting etc. I mean I have no idea why guy's here go to the cargo area this time of year. The light is simply horrible, it's too high when it's behind you and if you wait till it gets low it's way behind AI and is basically lighting the ass of the plane. Again shooting in conditions that are outside their skill level. Keep it simple and stick to the basics. Learn to get the sun behind you and low enough so that it doesn't blow everything out, yet throws light on the entire fuselage. Learn to position yourself to achieve this, when you get to famous spots, see where the sun is. Read a chapter is a book about lighting and exposure. I did that and it helped my by leaps and bounds. Etc. You would also do yourself some good on reading the manual on your camera. It's mostly dry but does contain some valuable info on things like settings and how to acheive certain things with it.

[jakbar]

Read a chapter is a book about lighting and exposure.

I could not agree more. I picked up a book on lighting/exposure about two years ago, and it was one of the best purchases I ever made. I also bought a book dealing with color, which was also very good.

[PhilDernerJr]

Honestly, some excellent points.

For me, I was learning about camera settings and post-processing for a couple years before I got my first camera. I think it's backwards today.

We have a lot of talent around here, and there's so many people that do it, that it makes it look easy. So people who are new to the hobby do little research before grabbing either any old camera or even a really good camera, expecting JP or Anet results right away.

Not pointing fingers here, but it's something you see on any aviation message board, are just a couple people who rely on others much more than needed. Because some of the more experienced enthusiasts ARE so helpful, the work gets passed on to them, with little actually learned from the advice given. New people either asking for a particular workflow for every single batch of photos they take....not learning to do it on their own next time. Or even just asking others to edit it for them.

I remember before I had a camera, Art Brett or Tom Turner would let me use their camera for a few shots. I couldn't wait to post-process my own photos. Art would show me some techniques and I'd play in Photoshop for hours playing catch up, trying to find more info online and such.

Thankfully, most people are ARE eager to genuinely learn and have ran with it, already showing everyone their talent. Gordon is a great example of that.

[NIKV69]

You raise a good point Phil. In this day and age and with anet and cheap (but good) DSLRs most are buying first. Which is fine, I think that is a great way to go as long as you make an effort to understand how that thing works.

[nwafan20]

I agree with the points you guys raise up.

As someone of the generation that you are speaking of, here is how it worked for me.

I bought an advanced P+S camera with full manual controls. My father had about 15 photography books (granted, they were from the film age) I read through each and every one. I then moved onto the digital side of the study and read up on that information via the internet and posting questions on forums (including this one if you guys remember) About a year and a half after working full manual with my point and shoot, I felt I was ready for an SLR, I wouldn't buy one until I personally felt I was ready to stay out of full auto mode. So, January 2007 I bought my XTi with a 28-105 and 70-300 IS. Before touching the camera, I read through the manual twice, picking up some good hints on SLR photography. Finally, I picked up the camera and did around 200 shots of random things to get my technique down and test different features and such.

Granted, I am not the best photographer, and I am fairly new to the world of SLR photography, but I felt that this way of doing it helped me get the most out of my early years in learning the techniques and the technical side of photography.

If I were to do it all over again, would I do anything different? Probably not, it worked very well and I personally feel I know the technical side of it quite well, I just need to wait as my skill matches it ;) I would recommend doing it this way to anyone who is just getting into photography, work with a P+S in full manual first.

[Gerard]

>You know this is the second post in about a week where people are bashing other people's photos...What the heck is going on? I'm really surprised at the level of total disrespect I see lately.<

Hehe, I totally agree. The pictures look fine to me. :roll: Sheesh.

[Nonstop2AUH]

Speaking as someone who is not a photographer, I enjoy seeing any and all aviation pics. I know it's a serious hobby for many of you and there's some friendly competition for a.net and jp postings, but I'm sure I'm not the only one here who appreciates all of it. As with, say, Amanda Bynes, unless it's totally blurry or taken from too far away, there's no such thing as a bad aviation photo.

[Gerard]

[>Speaking as someone who is not a photographer, I enjoy seeing any and all aviation pics. I know it's a serious hobby for many of you and there's some friendly competition for a.net and jp postings, but I'm sure I'm not the only one here who appreciates all of it. As with, say, Amanda Bynes, unless it's totally blurry or taken from too far away, there's no such thing as a bad aviation photo<

Yup yup yeah!! Great post!!