Thousands of O'Hare Employee Badges Missing

[Matt Molnar]

CBS 2 in Chicago has discovered that 3,807 employee badges used to access secure areas at O'Hare Airport are missing, and the TSA doesn't seem very interested in investigating.

http://cbs2chicago.com/homepage/local_s ... 24625.html (http://cbs2chicago.com/homepage/local_story_176224625.html)

[adam613]

Since when does the TSA get involved in making anything more secure? Come on, reasonable expectations people...

[hiss srq]

Oh sheesh! Well the up side is if these badges were not coded than the risk is reduced. Obviously no good either way but for some reason I have my doubts that these badges are not in the hands of the bad guys though you never know. The chip card might just be lost. Not only that they need to be programed with the pin from the chips mother computer so to speak therefore meaning that the only way in would be to piggy back through and than try not to get caught.

[Alex T]

Oh sheesh! Well the up side is if these badges were not coded than the risk is reduced. Obviously no good either way but for some reason I have my doubts that these badges are not in the hands of the bad guys though you never know. The chip card might just be lost. Not only that they need to be programed with the pin from the chips mother computer so to speak therefore meaning that the only way in would be to piggy back through and than try not to get caught.

My God they better not piggy back. I am terrified someone will do that to me so I am always watching behind me making sure no one is following me :shock:

That certainly is bad, and how did the employees lose their badges like that? Are they Airport employees or airline employees?

Alex

Edit- Read it again, seems to be Mesa. Hmmh

[Matt Molnar]

The main problems cited in the article:

* badge access to the airport via a non-electronic back gate (i.e. you flash your badge to the guard and he lets you in, no search required)
* piggybacking
* employees sharing access codes

[T-Bird76]

Not the first time this has happened....

[emshighway]

Since when does the TSA get involved in making anything more secure? Come on, reasonable expectations people...

So you base your assumptions on the word of a fired employee. Nothing in the article says TSA isn't investigating or doing something.

There are programs in place where if a certain percentage of SIDA cards are missing the airport has to issue new designed cards to everyone.

There is a program where TSA screens employees.

There are inspectors out within the airport who look for "piggy-backers" and will fine them, the airlines and the airport.

SIDA badging is an airport responsibility. TSA is the regulating agency. If a problem is found they can/will enforce civil penalties against the violators.

By the way I worked with Paul Maniscalco. He is another one that should shut his mouth when he has no idea of what he speaks.

[hiss srq]

Bougus Bob program comes to mind correct EMS? And you are correct about the percentage statement without detailling it furthur.

[PhilDernerJr]

"Piggybacking" is a general security issue, and has NOTHING to do with lost badges. As noted, they watch for that more than people realize, and other airport employees ARE willing to report such activity.....ALL take it very seriously.

As for the mentioning of the recent JFK plot...what does thathave to do with the ID cards? The employee DID undergo a backgroudn check. What else should the authorities do? What do people seriously recommend? Should we shut downt he airports or tial every potential airport employeef or 6 months to see if they might be a terrorist?

[hiss srq]

It has everythingt to do with a piggy back. If a person has a badge and makes it through the door with you without you knowing and that badge is not authorized and this person has bad intentions than it is going to have EVERYTHING to do with it and it is something that is extremely easy to do once you have the bage because most people do not care past the fact that the pic matches your face on the badge which is why we have special programs at LGA.

[emshighway]

It has everythingt to do with a piggy back. If a person has a badge and makes it through the door with you without you knowing and that badge is not authorized and this person has bad intentions than it is going to have EVERYTHING to do with it and it is something that is extremely easy to do once you have the bage because most people do not care past the fact that the pic matches your face on the badge which is why we have special programs at LGA.

There should never be a situation where someone piggybacks on you and you don't know it. If in your scenario someone did piggyback without you knowing it wouldn't matter if they had a badge or not since they are gaining access on your badge. If they don't have a badge they should be challenged. Remember anyone can challenge anyone else.

This is the rule in every airport so it isn't secret.

We try to piggyback and put our badges away to see if we can get away with it. Trust me if we do it is going to be a very bad day for you. That goes for not challenging also.

[cancidas]

Since when does the TSA get involved in making anything more secure? Come on, reasonable expectations people...

funniest comment i've heard all week!

[PhilDernerJr]

It has everythingt to do with a piggy back. If a person has a badge and makes it through the door with you without you knowing and that badge is not authorized and this person has bad intentions than it is going to have EVERYTHING to do with it and it is something that is extremely easy to do once you have the bage because most people do not care past the fact that the pic matches your face on the badge which is why we have special programs at LGA.

Just because a badge is lost or stolen, or the person was terminated and hasn't given back that card....that doesn't mean that the card has not be deactivated. You can't piggyback with a deactivated card.

[hiss srq]

Ummmm... How not Phil? Piggybacking means not useing your own card and pin which means it is irrelevant wheter or not you have an active badge. You have still gained access to areas which are restricted to you. I could probably piggyback you at JFK if I wanted to but would I? Certainly not. It is not impossible Phil. If anything it is pretty easy ask EMS. And like he said it will not be a nice day for anyone when a person gets away with it.

[emshighway]

As hiss stated piggybacking is going through a door behind someone else before the door closes. The person swiping has the responsibility to ensure the door closes without someone piggybacking.

[emshighway]

Since when does the TSA get involved in making anything more secure? Come on, reasonable expectations people...

funniest comment i've heard all week!

I thought it was the stupidest...

[PhilDernerJr]

Ummmm... How not Phil? Piggybacking means not useing your own card and pin which means it is irrelevant wheter or not you have an active badge. ]/quote]

Exactly. Or any badge for that matter.....which was my original point to beginw ith. Lost or stolen badges have nothing to do with piggybacking. Separate issues and separate safety measures.

[quote="hiss srq":6a91b] I could probably piggyback you at JFK if I wanted to but would I? Certainly not.

Are you implying that I have ramp access at JFK? COOL! haha


It is not impossible Phil. If anything it is pretty easy ask EMS. And like he said it will not be a nice day for anyone when a person gets away with it.[/quote:6a91b]

I agree, but the article implies that TSA/DHS/Airport Management is doing something WRONG, when they aren't. That is unless you have a solution for the piggybacking.

[emshighway]

The report is very misleading. 3807 badges missing. In what time frame? The "whistleblower" wasn't interviewed. So what, what would they have gotten from her. It is her word that there were piggybackers. OK, you set up to look for piggybackers, you don't go on TV and tell people you are doing it.

Mesa was fined $47,000 for the badges they lost. That is doing something.

With the size of O'Hare it is difficult to secure every single door without the assistance of the employees.

[T-Bird76]

The report is very misleading. 3807 badges missing. In what time frame? The "whistleblower" wasn't interviewed. So what, what would they have gotten from her. It is her word that there were piggybackers. OK, you set up to look for piggybackers, you don't go on TV and tell people you are doing it.

Mesa was fined $47,000 for the badges they lost. That is doing something.

With the size of O'Hare it is difficult to secure every single door without the assistance of the employees.

More then likely that figure will come down if not forgiven entirely. If Mesa doesn't have a history of regulatory issues that figure is just for show. I work with many Federal and State Agencies and whenever we get a fine 10 out of 10 times we can mitigate it down or have it taken away as long as we file a corrective action plan and show we are following it. The real issue is the handling of the badges, where they are kept, who has access to them.

[Smartass Flyboy]

And you are correct about the percentage statement without detailling it furthur.

Yeah Ryan he has it right. I won't get into the actual percentages but I have been through 2 different complete re-badgings due to an airport exceeding it. Oh BTW, happy now? I finally signed up.

[skipper]

In EWR they have guards at all of the access doors so that you can not piggyback. The guards make sure that everyone that goes through the door has swiped their ID.

[emshighway]

The report is very misleading. 3807 badges missing. In what time frame? The "whistleblower" wasn't interviewed. So what, what would they have gotten from her. It is her word that there were piggybackers. OK, you set up to look for piggybackers, you don't go on TV and tell people you are doing it.

Mesa was fined $47,000 for the badges they lost. That is doing something.

With the size of O'Hare it is difficult to secure every single door without the assistance of the employees.

More then likely that figure will come down if not forgiven entirely. If Mesa doesn't have a history of regulatory issues that figure is just for show. I work with many Federal and State Agencies and whenever we get a fine 10 out of 10 times we can mitigate it down or have it taken away as long as we file a corrective action plan and show we are following it. The real issue is the handling of the badges, where they are kept, who has access to them.

Oh yea, once the lawyers get involved that number gets changed. It is only the recommended fine.

[emshighway]

In EWR they have guards at all of the access doors so that you can not piggyback. The guards make sure that everyone that goes through the door has swiped their ID.

That is a heafty price most airports can't afford. Remember EWR is under the microscope from their favorite local newspaper.

[hiss srq]

[quote="hiss srq":30fbd] And you are correct about the percentage statement without detailling it furthur.

Yeah Ryan he has it right. I won't get into the actual percentages but I have been through 2 different complete re-badgings due to an airport exceeding it. Oh BTW, happy now? I finally signed up.[/quote:30fbd]

Hey Hey Hey!! Welcome aboard. By the writing style it could only be you Mike!

[skipper]

In EWR they have guards at all of the access doors so that you can not piggyback. The guards make sure that everyone that goes through the door has swiped their ID.

That is a heafty price most airports can't afford. Remember EWR is under the microscope from their favorite local newspaper.

I am not sure this is something that most airports can not afford. It is not TSA people that guard the door but local airport hired security at $7/hour. $7/hour does not seem very luxurious to me.

[PhilDernerJr]

Just becuase it might not be luxurious for a guard does not mean that the costs don't stack up for the employer.

Multiply $7 an hour times 24 hours times the HUNDREDS (or thousands even?) of doors that each TERMINAL has. Plus the cost of benefits, uniforms, training and more.

In order for me to get my office, I access or use my card or gain access to up to 4 secured doors after going through security. Keep in mind how many offices, concourses, floors, and different areas there are in an airport.

[skipper]

Hmm in EWR there is 1 access door per terminal. 3 terminals. 3x24x8=$576/day. They wouldn't be needed at all 4 doors, just the first one that grants you access to the others. But you said that it is AFTER you have gone through security in which case there are lots of doors. But we are talking about bypassing security.

[PhilDernerJr]

You can get through security with a boarding pass. From there, there are literally hundreds of different doors that gets you access to the ramp, or gives you access to offices that can give people the chance to steal uniforms or other items that are also very sensitive to security.

I'm not sure what you do at EWR, but I'm sure there's much more than one door per terminal that gives people acccess to sensitive areas. That wouldbe a LOT of employees bottlenecking.

[njgtr82]

You can get through security with a boarding pass. From there, there are literally hundreds of different doors that gets you access to the ramp, or gives you access to offices that can give people the chance to steal uniforms or other items that are also very sensitive to security.

I'm not sure what you do at EWR, but I'm sure there's much more than one door per terminal that gives people acccess to sensitive areas. That wouldbe a LOT of employees bottlenecking.

I know the door he is talking about and he is right. Theres one door where you swipe your id, then show it to him, as he looks at his computer which brings up a picture of you to compare. You then walk through the door which leads directly to the ramp. When I worked over there I never saw more then 10-15 people in line at a time.

[PhilDernerJr]

That's jsut one way to aaccess the ramp. I'm sure there are many other ways to do so.

As I'm sitting here now, I am thinking about one terminal at a local airport that has up to a hundred ways to access to the terminal from before and beyond security. Swiping doors, active or inactive boarding gates, outside fences, etc.

The one that you're talking about sounds like that one already has a guard. So what's the problem? I'm saying that every point of access having a guard would be extremely expensive, which is why there are those swipe cards to begin with.

My point about swiping through 4 doors was not saying that it's not easy to get to the ramp through one door. It was to rebutt the suggestion that there by a guard at every door that requires and ID....which defeats the ID's purpose.

[emshighway]

I am not sure this is something that most airports can not afford. It is not TSA people that guard the door but local airport hired security at $7/hour. $7/hour does not seem very luxurious to me.

As stated it isn't just $7 and these are not people employeed by the airport but by a contractor. So add the benefits, insurance and the contractor cut then multiply by three shifts per position and the cost goes up and up.

[skipper]

Well then I guess EWR is just not fiscally responsible since they do it with no problem.

[emshighway]

Well then I guess EWR is just not fiscally responsible since they do it with no problem.

They are probably charging the airlines. It is the PANYNJ way.

[skipper]

Well then I guess EWR is just not fiscally responsible since they do it with no problem.

They are probably charging the airlines. It is the PANYNJ way.

You've got that right. :lol: They sure are not hurting for money. I'm surprised I am not charged for the jet fuel grime that covers my car each week from parking there.