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Thread: KEWR 11/23/14

  1. #16
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    Gintaras, it's got nothing to do with not sharing locations. He was warned not to hang out at EWR because of the rush of being met by authorities but he insisted on going there and hanging out. EWR is not spotter friendly. Simple as that. If he insists on not listening, and going there and hanging out for lengthy periods then he will eventually risk getting detained.
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  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gintaras B. View Post
    Steve...I hope you don't jinx yourself...unless you do some bagde(s)

    NYC Aviation Planespotting guide does list Bayswaters more dangerous, unfriendly to spotters, as EWR...

    Just wonder...why kid spotting @ EWR is treated on this forum different than I was:

    http://nycaviation.com/forum/threads...e-so-dangerous

    Steve...why some of you are so mean to others? Does it make feel better about yourself? "I told you so"..."He obviously doesn't have any intention of listening to anybody on here"..."The only way he well learn is when he gets detained"...

    Some get more access to planes, to get better shots...some will share, some(EGOs) - won't....

    Why can't WE be more friendly to each other...to help each other????
    It's true, Bayswater is said to be more dangerous than EWR on the guides here.
    And yeah, comparing these two forms...I am treated as a 5 year old and Gintaras is treated fairly with respect?
    I am simply sharing my experience, as a request from another spotter here.
    I am not listening to you guys to not go to EWR. I am doing it because I am trying to HELP, and make EWR more friendly. And obviously that isn't going to well, and I am sharing what my experience was. It seems that some of you don't appreciate it. I want to also share videos/pictures, not just share my spotting experience. Is it wrong to share pictures and experiences from Newark?

  3. #18
    Senior Member lijk604's Avatar
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    It's not wrong to share your experience. But don't come across as all surprised that you were harassed by the authorities at EWR, when you have been told numbers times that spotting at EWR is very difficult at best by yourself, and that groups are not recommended. You need to be stealthy at EWR, and a group does not say stealth at all.

    Gintaras, we have tried to be nice. What you are seeing from us is frustration and head shaking. In my over 10 years of spotting, I have NEVER had an issue at Bayswater. NEVER.
    The only times that I heard that someone was given an issue was 1) Being there before the park officially opened. Some clever spotter found an alternate way into the park, and the park rangers were not happy about that. 2) Security is tight whenever AF1 is due in, especially since 31L is the preferred runway for them.

    Now, if someone were doing something to attract attention to themselves in a negative way, that's on them. I don't know why you were given a hard time there, so I cannot comment about it, nor will I speculate that you were bringing attention to yourself. I have sat there in a lawn chair shooting for hours with the only problem being the damn bugs.

  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by lijk604 View Post
    It's not wrong to share your experience. But don't come across as all surprised that you were harassed by the authorities at EWR, when you have been told numbers times that spotting at EWR is very difficult at best by yourself, and that groups are not recommended. You need to be stealthy at EWR, and a group does not say stealth at all.

    Gintaras, we have tried to be nice. What you are seeing from us is frustration and head shaking. In my over 10 years of spotting, I have NEVER had an issue at Bayswater. NEVER.
    The only times that I heard that someone was given an issue was 1) Being there before the park officially opened. Some clever spotter found an alternate way into the park, and the park rangers were not happy about that. 2) Security is tight whenever AF1 is due in, especially since 31L is the preferred runway for them.

    Now, if someone were doing something to attract attention to themselves in a negative way, that's on them. I don't know why you were given a hard time there, so I cannot comment about it, nor will I speculate that you were bringing attention to yourself. I have sat there in a lawn chair shooting for hours with the only problem being the damn bugs.
    Understood, but it seems like it is right now. I am also surprised at the reactions/differences between this thread vs. Gintaras' spotting experience at Bayswater. Well, EWR is over for me now after what happened. Even though the drive to JFK is twice as long for me, it will be worth it to get some quality time plane spotting

    And for Bayswater, I have never seen police/or had an issue there. And yeah, the only problem there is the bugs ;)

  5. #20
    Senior Member Zee71's Avatar
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    BTW .... I'm not seeing it either where it states or references that Bayswater is more dangerous than EWR in the guides. As John, mentioned it's the bugs during the summer months that I hate too. I too have brought my chair, spotted and chatted there with many other spotters without incident.

    Take this a lesson learned and enjoy the hobby and respect the law.
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  6. #21
    Senior Member skyteam18's Avatar
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    It's sad how this forum is composed of spineless people when it comes to ewr. Nothing will change as long as everyone is submissive to power tripping cops.

  7. #22
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    What's sad is that the forum is full of asshats that only post when there is a chance to add to create or add to drama.
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  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zee71 View Post
    BTW .... I'm not seeing it either where it states or references that Bayswater is more dangerous than EWR in the guides. As John, mentioned it's the bugs during the summer months that I hate too. I too have brought my chair, spotted and chatted there with many other spotters without incident.

    Take this a lesson learned and enjoy the hobby and respect the law.
    The word "detained" in Bayswater makes it seem more dangerous than the current EWR description.
    Indeed I will, thank you.
    Oh, and this may be off-topic here...but I have a spot at EWR, not on airport property that you can get fair shots from of aircraft arriving on 4R. It's located on Dowd Rd, and from my experiences there, no security/police issues. But still, I am not going back there :) Going to completely avoid EWR.

  9. #24
    Senior Member Gerard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CathayA340 View Post
    It's true, Bayswater is said to be more dangerous than EWR on the guides here.
    Why is the word "dangerous" used in relation to Bayswater? Why is the word "dangerous" being used in relation to EWR?
    Seriously, unless you run the risk of personal bodily injury while spotting there STOP using that word!! Being questioned by the authorities and possible being
    detained for a few minutes does not constitute danger!! Stop being so friggin dramatic!!

  10. #25
    Senior Member NIKV69's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skyteam18 View Post
    It's sad how this forum is composed of spineless people when it comes to ewr. Nothing will change as long as everyone is submissive to power tripping cops.
    It has nothing to do with being spineless. EWR is the type of airfield that you have to use your head. There are certain things like never going there as a group for starters. I go alone and lay low. You can last hours there if you just use your common sense and know when to cut your losses.
    'My idea of a good picture is one that's in focus and of a famous person doing something unfamous.' Andy Warhol

  11. #26
    Senior Member skyteam18's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NIKV69 View Post
    It has nothing to do with being spineless. EWR is the type of airfield that you have to use your head. There are certain things like never going there as a group for starters. I go alone and lay low. You can last hours there if you just use your common sense and know when to cut your losses.
    "I go it alone and lay low." <--- THIS is why you have a problem at EWR.

    As long as you create the environment of "I'm doing an illegal activity" while shoot photos of airplanes, the public and the police will perceive this as something to be feared and dealt with.

    This is what makes me mad. Spotters around EWR have (whether knowingly or unknowingly) by their actions while shooting planes ("I go alone and lay low") have created a troubled relationship between hobbyists and authorities to the extent that I won't come up and shoot photos around EWR, even though it's perfectly legal activity.

    I have some ideas on how to improve the spotting culture are EWR and will gladly share them.

  12. #27
    Senior Member NIKV69's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skyteam18 View Post
    "I go it alone and lay low." <--- THIS is why you have a problem at EWR.

    As long as you create the environment of "I'm doing an illegal activity" while shoot photos of airplanes, the public and the police will perceive this as something to be feared and dealt with.

    This is what makes me mad. Spotters around EWR have (whether knowingly or unknowingly) by their actions while shooting planes ("I go alone and lay low") have created a troubled relationship between hobbyists and authorities to the extent that I won't come up and shoot photos around EWR, even though it's perfectly legal activity.

    I have some ideas on how to improve the spotting culture are EWR and will gladly share them.

    You really have no idea what you are talking about. I have shot EWR many times and never really had any issues. It isn't the behavior of spotters that is the reason authorities don't tolerate us as they do at JFK. You should research things before you insult guys who have been in the hobby for years and have shot there. If you don't want to shoot there, it sounds like you would be better not coming.

    Also I would love to hear your ideas for improving the spotting culture.
    'My idea of a good picture is one that's in focus and of a famous person doing something unfamous.' Andy Warhol

  13. #28
    Senior Member skyteam18's Avatar
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    Honest question: Why don't the authorities at EWR tolerate you the same way as they do at JFK?

  14. #29
    Senior Member NIKV69's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skyteam18 View Post
    Honest question: Why don't the authorities at EWR tolerate you the same way as they do at JFK?
    How in the name of God do I know? I don't work for for Port Authority. It's always been a high security spot and contrary to your assumptions, not caused by spotters behaving a certain way. If you have nothing to do for 2 hours google it and you will see for the last 12 years spotters around the world have had issues there, no matter how they behaved. So before you keep insulting us with your conspiracy theories, research these things before you type your statements.

    And an apology wouldn't be a bad idea since you basically insulted a lot of guys who have been shooting planes for a long time there.
    'My idea of a good picture is one that's in focus and of a famous person doing something unfamous.' Andy Warhol

  15. #30
    Administrator PhilDernerJr's Avatar
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    First, regardless of your views, I wish some people were better at communicating with one another instead of namecalling. When we see incidents like this, even if it is frustrating to us, we still need to work together, or at least treat each other with respect. Offending posts will be moderated.

    Though Bayswater has had its share of incidents (I myself have been detained there), there have been hundreds and hundreds of visits that people have had with NO issue whatsoever, so I consider the risk to be less. Also, when I was detained, the police were not as rude or aggressive as at EWR.

    At EWR, it seems that the police are ALWAYS like that, that your chances of receiving that type of attention is EXPECTED almost EVERY time you go. Not the case at Bayswater.

    If people have suggestions on the wording of the EWR guide on this site to emphasize its frequency of police encounters, I'd have no problem with that.

    As for this thread, should the spotter have been shocked to receive that attention? Not at all. Also, I don't think the spotter was COMPLAINING, but just sharing his story. And we should encourage that instead of acting like he necessarily did something wrong or as though HE is the problem here.

    He has a right to go and TRY to spot, as it is not illegal. And on top of that, the incidents should be reported here, because it helps all of us to always know what the environment is at an airport, even if it is what we have come to typically expect. Ripping on him only deters people like him from posting their experiences, and then we are all less in-the-know.

    The big problem is EWR, not the spotters that "should know better."
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