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Thread: Well, didn't think that hobby can be so dangerous

  1. #1
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    Well, didn't think that hobby can be so dangerous

    Today I drove to Bayswaters Park a little after noon...no one else was there...later, some other airplane spotter came...we didn't talk...I was taking photos and videos...Another guy was taking photos of aircrafts as well...So, he left, and I was alone...about 4pm..or so...I saw that Aero Mexico was taxiing for take-off and deceided to wait for...
    Next thing, I see a couple police officers coming right at me and asking: "what are doing here"...
    Me: "I'm taking photos of airplanes"...I must looked very suspicious, my Radio Shack scanner was next to me...

    Blah, blah, blah...they took me outside park, there were 2 police cars with lights flashing..another guy, who was at park taking photos, was there already questioned by police...
    We been held on Mott Ave for another 1/2 hour while one police officer was on the phone...
    After...me and another guy were hand-cuffed, and taken in 101 precint, that's on same Mott Ave...
    After some waiting and some questioning, police officers did apologize and drove us to our parked cars next to Bayswater Park...

    I'm sure, I'll remember that old-fart paranoid guy with a wife and a dog...who did call police because of his sickness - paranoia...
    Next time I'm @ Baywaters and I see that same guy...I might call police - guy need medical attention...

    Detectives and other police officers were very nice to us, except, little policemen - one police woman was so dumb, she was telling that taking pictures of aircrafts - against Federal Law....
    When I told her: "I heard, that LAX - Los Angeles Airport has a deck for aircraft spotters", She told me: "well, Los Angeles isn't New Your..." Then...I told her: "What do you now about FEDERAL LAWS?...If it's in NYC against "The Federal Law", it's NOT against in LA ...
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  2. #2
    Senior Member yankees368's Avatar
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    That is all pretty insane. I have had nothing but good encounters with the NYPD. So sorry this had to go down the way it did. Unreal.
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    Quote Originally Posted by yankees368 View Post
    That is all pretty insane. I have had nothing but good encounters with the NYPD. So sorry this had to go down the way it did. Unreal.
    It wasn't a fun when they put hand-cuffs on me...

    I'm more sorry for another guy - who was taken to 101 precint with me - he was very first time @ Bayswaters Park...and as he said - maybe last time...And he told me that found that location from this site - NYC Aviation...And he told me, that has some pics on Airliners.net...

    I'm not afraid going to Bayswaters again...And I won't forget that old ******* with wife and dog...who called police...He was watching on the street while cops walked me away from the park...
    Next time that old-fart with his old slut and a dog walks into park, I'll call police....
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    Senior Member gonzalu's Avatar
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    Even when the president was in town and we got kicked out of the park for the first time ever, I actually was a bit pushy asking why, and even as the PO got a bit impatient in telling "you just have to go, OK!!" and still nothing of the sort.

    You MUST be told why you are being detained or arrested. And technically it is a State Park so I would have called the State Park or regular State Police and reported the incident. Also, you should re-visit that same precinct and ask to speak to a supervisor and report the fact that you were told it is against federal law to take pictures of airplanes from a public park. Make sure you let them know that you know the law and your rights.

    Once again, NEVER been arrested ever, and I have done far worse than take pictures of planes in my life to warrant some handcuffs and always ended up with nothing more than a stern warning or heated argument with the officers.

    Remember to ALWAYS ask if you can go about your business and if not, you must ask why you are being held against your will. A Police Officer has the right to hold you without charging you or arresting you in the State of New York. A Peace Officer MUST make an arrest through and through. NO ONE can hold you against your will unless they make a Citizen's Arrest ... only a Police Officer can do so. And even then they have limited time in which to question you, charge you with a crime or crimes or let you go.

    I would not let this just go away without knowing full well why you were detained.
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    Senior Member gonzalu's Avatar
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    BTW, in case this wasn't obvious... in general, we are in someone's neighborhood and we must behave accordingly... respectful of people's privacy and right to a quiet peaceful living in their homes and neighborhood. So, while in the area and inside the park, even though it is a public place, we should and must behave accordingly.

    Gintaras, did you have any interaction with the folks you are referring to? We have a lot of people call the cops on us and we have NEVER had any more than a friendly exchange with the officers that respond. So I am curious as to what exactly happened between you and the couple and dog.
    Manny Gonzalez
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    Senior Member NIKV69's Avatar
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    Cuffs? Taken to precinct. Insane.
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    Quote Originally Posted by gonzalu View Post
    BTW, in case this wasn't obvious... in general, we are in someone's neighborhood and we must behave accordingly... respectful of people's privacy and right to a quiet peaceful living in their homes and neighborhood. So, while in the area and inside the park, even though it is a public place, we should and must behave accordingly.

    Gintaras, did you have any interaction with the folks you are referring to? We have a lot of people call the cops on us and we have NEVER had any more than a friendly exchange with the officers that respond. So I am curious as to what exactly happened between you and the couple and dog.
    Manny,
    Guy with a woman and a dog came to me, looked at me - what I was doing and said: "Hi". I said: "hi" and that's all it was...
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    Administrator PhilDernerJr's Avatar
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    This disgusts me. They stomped all over your rights and violated the law themselves. You were arrested with no probably cause or crime having been committed.

    I have been detained once by the 101st Pct before, also from Bayswater, but we were not cuffed. We cooperated because they said that there were no detectives on the street and asked/forced us to go with them in a police van to meet and speak with them.

    My own personal suggestion would be for you to pursue this, to go back to them and get some answers. IT's completely ridiculous that this could happen here.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gintaras B. View Post
    Detectives and other police officers were very nice to us, except, little policemen - one police woman was so dumb, she was telling that taking pictures of aircrafts - against Federal Law....
    When I told her: "I heard, that LAX - Los Angeles Airport has a deck for aircraft spotters", She told me: "well, Los Angeles isn't New Your..." Then...I told her: "What do you now about FEDERAL LAWS?...If it's in NYC against "The Federal Law", it's NOT against in LA ...
    Always pretty disturbing when you're at the mercy of someone with such ignorance that has a gun and a badge. Sorry about your experience.
    My name is Disco Stu and I love disco music.

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    Senior Member gonzalu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by disco stu View Post
    Always pretty disturbing when you're at the mercy of someone with such ignorance that has a gun and a badge. Sorry about your experience.
    Well we don't really know the whole story... we only have one side and it seems to have three sides, perhaps more. This is why we encourage folks to not be intimidated and go about the situation in a very professional and always respectful way but definitely get answers.

    I used to get stopped by CBP every single time I re-entered the US at any port of entry in the US and get set to a back room and always allowed to leave after a lot of keys were pressed and NEVER an answer as to why. I then slowly pursued this with every possible avenue available to me and I finally got some information. It took a lot of letters and a lot of phone calls. My name is an alias to at least two individuals (one from Dominican Republic, the other from Mexico) who are on various lists and such which meant ANYONE would be stopped with a similar alias. I eventually had my answers and also an opportunity to voice my opinion that the policy of NOT telling the person who is NOT the guilty party yet being questioned and detained is not acceptable. I did vow to take this as high as I had to to bring out the information at least to me. Ultimately the solution was to enroll in Global Entry / SENTRI / NEXUS and I no longer face scrutiny as I have been pre-screened.

    It did not resolve the issue of me having knowledge of what exactly is contained in their files about me personally, but at least I don't scare the hell out of my family when I am taken away from them at the airport for :30 minutes ...

    Find out, inquire, tell. The same way they tell you "if you see something, say something" it applies just as well the other way. It may uncover wrongdoing that would normally be hidden because most people are afraid of the law.
    Manny Gonzalez
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    Quote Originally Posted by disco stu View Post
    Always pretty disturbing when you're at the mercy of someone with such ignorance that has a gun and a badge. Sorry about your experience.
    Thanks,

    I'm really sorry about AeroMexico I saw taxiing for take off...I was thinking - take photos of aircraft and I'm done for today(well, yesterday)...

    Another thing, there was a guy hand-cuffed and brought to 101, he wasn't even taking photos - prolly a friend of a guy that was taking photos at Bayswaters...
    Imagine, I do drive a friend who likes to take photos of aircrafts and get arrested together...



    I'm not really mad at cops...The Guy - some redneck paranoid, who called cops - really pisses me off...I do remember him...Would like to see him next time I'm @ Bayswater, to walk him into park...
    I wouldn't say him a word, but I would try to make him experience the same...I do know, 2 bads don't make One Good, but I'd like to make this guy to forget his way to Bayswaters Park....

    And, if there were 10-15 guys taking photos of aircrafts, we, sure, could make it happen....
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    Quote Originally Posted by gonzalu View Post
    Well we don't really know the whole story... we only have one side and it seems to have three sides, perhaps more. This is why we encourage folks to not be intimidated and go about the situation in a very professional and always respectful way but definitely get answers.



    Find out, inquire, tell. The same way they tell you "if you see something, say something" it applies just as well the other way. It may uncover wrongdoing that would normally be hidden because most people are afraid of the law.
    Manny, you could go to 101 to find out rest of the story...
    I have nothing to hide...
    And I do believe, another guy was just another Plane Spotter just like me...

    "If You See Something, Say Something" - TV ad that makes some people paranoid..

    In a History, many millions of people were killed or murdered in Gulags , because of: "If You See Something, Say Something"...

    When: "If You See Something, Say Something"...You have to be very responsible about, VERY RESPONSIBLE....Otherwise, you can send innocent people to jail or prison...

    Manny, I think, I saw you a couple times Brookville location...You didn't look like a terrorist and didn't look like you were hidding bazooka to get launched from you camera lense...
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  13. #13
    Senior Member gonzalu's Avatar
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    YEah, I meant for your sake and ours. I can't do it on your behalf :) My point being, don't let it just be that way (if you care about the why of course) it seems you don;t have closure and therefore neither do we. Lots of folks other than us here read these forums quietly and silently and will use the information here for themselves. It would be a shame if folks are scared off y secret police practices. That would be a terrible way for things to turn out.

    I personally have no issues and will hold my head up high and do what I am allowed to do in public places legally. And I never said you have anything to hide but there is a cloud over the story from the point of view of we have no clue what or why it happened. You said you were never told why you were being arrested. Were your rights ever read to you?

    Intersting you say about the bazooka ... in KMIA one year I was rolled on full cherries by about 10 marked and unmarked Sheriff and Airport police officers after taking out my 200-400mm f/4 and standing on a rock by the Furniture Store location. Apparently the Tower called me in as holding a suspicious object. The best part is how the officers handled it... one of them came up to me (I was pretty shaken up by the instant show of force of course but never afraid) and was so apologetic for scaring me and for "bothering me" I was so impressed by their professionalism... He immediately came over, shook hands, introduced himself... behind him were two SWAT type guys armed and armored to the teeth.. and after verifying my lens was indeed a lens, we chatted for about 15 minutes about photography and airplanes. One of the officers was dying to handle [my weapon] and I jokingly said if he let me shoot a few rounds with his Heckler & Koch MP5. I let him shoot a few frames with the camera and he was not impressed by the weight... anyway... bottom line is, it is all relative to how both you AND the police officers deal with the situation. We only have your side and it seems not even you have their side of the story. My point is, if you care about why it happened to you the way it did, I would urge you to pursue it.. .that's all :) I don't need to know any further for myself.
    Manny Gonzalez
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    Senior Member megatop412's Avatar
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    Gintaras, you do what you want, but if it were me...I would go in that precinct and read them the riot act. I would demand an actual supervisor to speak with, and then I would file a complaint against the officers in question. They knew they did not have to detain you, much less bring you in. People can say all they want 'they were just doing their jobs'. Well, you know what? Part of that job is to exercise appropriate discretion, and if what you say is EXACTLY what happened(notice my emphasis on your having been 100%, and I mean 100% truthful with us here), what happened was a completely inappropriate response to the situation they encountered. You have every right to make a complaint that will go into those officer's records. It isn't any different than if I have a customer complain about me to my boss and it goes in my folder. Threaten to use legal action if you need to get them to listen. Hell, some people do that for a lot less. They certainly infringed upon your rights as a law-abiding, tax-paying citizen, and knuckles should be rapped for it.

  15. #15
    Senior Member Gerard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phil D. View Post
    I have been detained once by the 101st Pct before, also from Bayswater, but we were not cuffed. We cooperated because they said that there were no detectives on the street and asked/forced us to go with them in a police van to meet and speak with them.
    .
    What Pct is The Mounds? 103? 113? Maybe the Rockaway boys can take a lesson from them!!
    And still wondering if there is more here though.

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