JFK Takeoff Routines

**Vinny Ohare** · 2012-09-30, 02:18 AM

I have been in the same house in Broad Channel for over 40 years and in the past 2 weeks the planes have been coming almost directly over my house. Today I went outside and looked at what has been happening and found it strange.

I don't know what the frequency of takeoffs is suppose to be but it seems to me that planes are taking off more often and closer together but after takeoff they are going in 3 or 4 different routes. Todays planes took off over 31L (I think that is right runway) and going out over Howard Beach. First plane makes a hard left and comes over the middle of Broad Channel heading right back towards the JFK control tower. It seems like 30 seconds later the same thing except the plane takes a wider route and the 3rd goes out over the ocean.

At first I thought these planes were coming into land on 22R(I Think) but the planes are going up and not coming down. Today when I saw it I think it was about 215 pm.

I have to walk down the end of my block and watch these planes bank so hard since I can see the end of the runway from there.

**gonzalu** · 2012-09-30, 05:47 AM

Go to the bottom and study the departure procedures. The Kennedy One dep is the most popular in my experience lately...

Note the Canarsie and Breezy Point climbs as well as the less used (if ever) Bridge Climb

http://www.airnav.com/airport/JFK

**Vinny Ohare** · 2012-09-30, 01:31 PM

Thanks Manny

After looking at that chart I want to say they are using the Bridge climb more often and making a hard left over the channel. Next time I see this I guess I will mark down the time and check flight aware?

**Speedbird1** · 2012-10-01, 06:18 AM

The rarest of all, is the ILS 13L Approach into JFK. I can't remember when it was last used.

**gonzalu** · 2012-10-01, 06:24 AM

Last year, during a very very heavy rainstorm, they were on the ILS 13L which was odd to see them coming in straight from the city ...

Vinny, the Bridge climb is never used... at least not officially ... can't remember ever hearing any other climb other than Canarsie and Breezy Point. Listen in on Clearance Delivery frequency and you hear them giving the actual climb procedure to the pilots aside from the Tower during transition to departure freq and/or at takeoff clearance

**PhilDernerJr** · 2012-10-01, 02:18 PM

If you're referring to the main initial turn off of the runway, this may be because yesterday (the 30th) there were 1hr+ taxi times out of JFK, so they have the planes make tighter and wider turns to the departure aircraft are not right behind each other in the air and they can decrease separation.

If you're talking about how they are leaving the local airspace, this is likely due to what is called the WHITE/WAVEY shuffle, which was being used yesterday. It involves two departure fixes, and ATC will alternate departures to those fixes to fit in more planes. This also lets them sneak in LGA and HPN departures as well, getting aircraft out of NY airspace faster.

Dispatchers need to plan departures to include both options for pilots so they have the options. Sometimes two departure runway will be available but planes are piled up on one because the pilots do not have fuel burn info for the other options. Pilots that are given this info by dispatch can then say "Yeah, I can depart on the runway" or "Yeah, I depart to that departure point" because they are equipped. This also comes in handy when there is weather in the area and some departure points are closed (as was the case with some northern fixes yesterday).

If you have questions, please ask. I hope I didn't get too technical...or not technical enough.

**gonzalu** · 2012-10-01, 02:29 PM

Hmmm, I think Phil is showing off that he does his job well enough that [his] pilots are [prepared]

... I could be wrong of course... LOL

**PhilDernerJr** · 2012-10-01, 02:48 PM

Haha. My company makes it policy to include such routes at certain times when necessary. It also helps being close to the airport, being able to communicate by radio as opposed to airlines that are from elsewhere.