How did it come to this?

[Perriwen]

As some of you know, I spot a lot at KDWH, which has always been one of the warmest and most welcoming places for spotters. Until this week. I go up to spot, and what do I see? Now the grassy observation area is sealed away behind a 10-foot barbed wire fence, and signs everywhere saying 'Warning: pilots and linemen ONLY beyond this point.' I spoke to the woman at the front desk about it, and said they felt the need to put up the fences because the pilots were too nervous with people being able to be so close to the planes (despite years and years without incident.) Now...all that is within view is a teeeny tiny fraction of the ramp and runway.

RIP Hooks as we knew it. :(

[Perriwen]

I'm still fuming over the discovery that my local airport now has gone all fenced in and chases away spotters. Even more so, I'm confused about what made the pilots so 'nervous' considering this place had been like that for decades without issue. Everyone was always so nice there and so open to talking...really helped inspire people to fly. What were they afraid was going to happen?

How did we go from those days of openness and inspiration to 'OMG unlessyouflyorworktheredon'tcometotheairportdon'tc omenearaplaneDON'TEVENLOOKATTHEPLANES!!!!!' At a small GA airport, of all things, too.

[moose135]

For the past decade, the government has worked to instill fear in the general public, under the guise of "security" and the "war on terrorism". You can't "fight" terrorism - you can only hope to change the conditions that cause people to use "terrorist" tactics to achieve their goals. All we have now is "security theater" and the continued erosion of our liberties.

"If you see something, say something."

[Perriwen]

For the past decade, the government has worked to instill fear in the general public, under the guise of "security" and the "war on terrorism". You can't "fight" terrorism - you can only hope to change the conditions that cause people to use "terrorist" tactics to achieve their goals. All we have now is "security theater" and the continued erosion of our liberties.

"If you see something, say something."

What amazes me, you can still walk up to a parked freight train or walk through a dock full of people's boats, but, somehow, that's okay but coming close to a Cessna or a Learjet is NONO!!!!

If someone could 'steal a Cessna' and do something, couldn't they steal a speedboat, or sneak into the cab of a parked train and get it moving?

[nssd70]

Railfanning isn't as easy in some places either.

Doug

[Perriwen]

Railfanning isn't as easy in some places either.

Doug

Are you serious? o.O What do they do, gawk at every mile of track?

[nssd70]

Tehachapi Loop in California used to be a great place to railfan,but now thet are putting up fences and gates. Several railfans in the Chicago have had numerous run ins with police and employees who have told them that taking photos of trains is illegal since 9/11. Some railfans including a editor of a railroad magazine have been arrested. I've been railfaning for aver 20 years and it's not the same as it was before 9/11. I have had police stop and tell me I couldn't take photos when I was clearly on a public sidewalk.

Doug

[moose135]

A few years back, the MTA here in New York (they run the subways, LIRR, and other facilities in the metro area) proposed a rule that would ban photography in the NYC subway system. The rule was never enacted - the NY chapter of the ACLU fought it, and the MTA decided to drop the proposal. Even though there was no rule, the police tried to enforce a photography ban - even after a memo to officers went out explaining the legality of photography on the subway. Despite all that, photographers are still improperly arrested for photography in the subway system. From a lawyer I heard from, if that happens to you, the city will generally settle your wrongful arrest claim for about $30,000.

[Perriwen]

You know, I wonder, if we ever DO reach the day of flying cars what might happen with the security then. Will they ease restrictions on planes since they'll more or less become buses or trucks, or....will we be forbidden from taking pictures anywhere outdoors ever?

[PhilDernerJr]

I know it's upsetting. Don't let it affect your morale or enthusiasm for the hobby though!

The restrictions always make me wonder if it has the opposite effect. Does keeping the public away add a stigma that makes people MORE worried about travel?

[megatop412]

As I stated in the thread regarding Iran,

"how long until it's "if you see people taking pictures, call the police!" hell, what am I saying we're already halfway there"

and

"eventually, it WILL come to the passage of actual laws prohibiting photography."


Not so paranoid thinking is it

[PhilDernerJr]

I disagree. I think that photography has and if not, is quickly becoming, a form of free speech that people will stand up for. The Subway example shows that. The protests taking place here in NYC and around the world, along with uprisings and such, all REQUIRE photography to push their cause. It's a major part of protest and freedom these days. Any laws that would truly limit photography, I feel, will be met hard from the public as a violation of rights.

There are not many examples of where spotters' ability to spot are truly prohibited...just a few isolated airports. EWR is tough because we just can't find any public property around there (God forbid Newark have a park or something haha).

[Perriwen]

I know it's upsetting. Don't let it affect your morale or enthusiasm for the hobby though!

The restrictions always make me wonder if it has the opposite effect. Does keeping the public away add a stigma that makes people MORE worried about travel?

I know one thing. Seeing a place that was once so open and welcoming surrounded by barbed wire was like...reverse prison.

As far as morale, it does take a hit, though, since now the closest spotting location is nearly 40 miles away.

[PhilDernerJr]

Being a smaller airport, I wonder if you might be able to be-friend the ops folks. Maybe walk in there one day with a random question that would be helpful to you, and then the next day some by with a box or two of doughnuts to thank them. Visit here and there (small box of munchkins as a token gift during such) and before you know you'll be airside!

[PhilDernerJr]

And FYI, I merged the two threads regarding this.