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Thread: New JFK departure routes

  1. #1
    Senior Member JHNA57's Avatar
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    New JFK departure routes

    I am probably the only Nassau County resident happy about this the new northerly departure routings going into effect today (Oct 20), but I do have a couple of questions.

    Will this routing be in use with any particular runway?
    Does this new departure have a particular "published" name (ie "Kennedy One, Merit Three")?

    Who better to ask than the EXPERTS on this site.

  2. #2
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    The new departure is called the Deeze1 (?) I think or similar. I tried to find it but couldn't load it on iPad.
    The new intersection is I think near HPN and it enables westbound departures from JFK to route north before turning west. There are also a few new nav waypoints and V16 and V229 have been re aligned.
    Look here for more information....http://flightaware.com/resources/air...JFK/DP/all/pdf

    Also noted that today, the first day of the new procedures, many flights to LAX were still routed over RBV and to SFO via Gayel...
    It's the fares, stupid

  3. #3
    Administrator PhilDernerJr's Avatar
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    October 20 is a revision date for manuals and charts within the normal intervals. The airspace redesign changes are kicking in today, though there are few significant changes "locally" for airports. This means that as spotters, we will not be seeing anything change in terms of where the planes are coming from within eye sight.

    To answer you question more specifically, for JFK, not much has changed. A few arrival procedures (entering the area's airspace, not to be confused with the actual approaches to land) have slight revisions to them. Most have the same names, although some changed.... Kingston 8 is now 9, Lendy 5 is now 6, and a few others.

    I'm still inspecting the whole redesign and I am expecting to have a full review of the expanded changes as soon as next week.
    Email me anytime at [email protected].

  4. #4
    Administrator PhilDernerJr's Avatar
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    Yes, DEEZZ1 is a newbie, but not noticeable close-in to the airport. It sends planes out to waypoint "DEEZZ" and then they follow the rest of the procedure out of the airspace. The only thing that might be slightly different is if ATC sends rwy 31 departures north or northeast immediately, which may not be very common with LGA's proximity. Again, nothin too different or drastic.
    Email me anytime at [email protected].

  5. #5
    Senior Member JHNA57's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phil D. View Post
    nothin too different or drastic.
    Reading the articles in the paper and watching it on the news you would think it was the begining of "DOOMSDAY"

  6. #6
    Moderator mirrodie's Avatar
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    Newsday. For idiots, by idiots.

    Deeze???? Really? I think its best called Deeze Nuts
    And I, I took the path less traveled by
    and that has made all the difference......yet...
    I have a feeling a handle of people are going to be very interested in what I post in the near future.

    http://www.jetphotos.net/showphotos.php?userid=187

  7. #7
    Kennedy right now is
    ILS 31R
    Visual 22L
    Visual 22R
    Departing 22R INT C
    SW DEP 31L INT KK

  8. #8
    Senior Member Speedbird1's Avatar
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    Little Has Changed !

    I was at the Brooklyn Botanic Garden on Oct. 22. The sky was very clear and aircraft still were overflying enroute to an Expwy/VIS 31 at LGA when suddenly I spotted well-above a Frontier A320, the AFR A388 from CDG. It was about alt. 16,000. I was actually spotting fall foliage which is my other hobby. I guess the A388 was routed over Canada via ING.

  9. #9
    Senior Member Idlewild's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Speedbird1 View Post
    I was at the Brooklyn Botanic Garden on Oct. 22. The sky was very clear and aircraft still were overflying enroute to an Expwy/VIS 31 at LGA when suddenly I spotted well-above a Frontier A320, the AFR A388 from CDG. It was about alt. 16,000. I was actually spotting fall foliage which is my other hobby. I guess the A388 was routed over Canada via ING.
    This approach has been used forever. Unless, the AF A388 has a different approach than the rest of the west-bound flights. I keep forgetting the name of the approach route/s. I know they fly over the Park Slope & LIC going in an easterly direction at around 15,000ft.
    Spotters have been Homeland Security before HS was a glimmer in the president's eye.

  10. #10
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    The IGN arrival is sometimes used by aircraft arriving from Europe on a more northerly route. While most arrive over CCC following the ENE arrival, some stay north if LI and head south from IGN to join the traffic flow into JFK.

    I don't think these changes affect arrivals as much as departures.
    It's the fares, stupid

  11. #11
    Administrator PhilDernerJr's Avatar
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    Reading more about it now, the route is mostly geared to ease congestion at Robinsville (RBV), a point over New Jersey that all high-altitude westbound JFK departures would converge on before heading to their next route segment, which made it somewhat of a bottleneck. The new departure procedure sends planes to Northern New Jersey and then can spread out and be directed to their filed airwayst. Choke-points like these are being addressed all over the US.

    Here you can see how it works. The green lines are aircraft heading out to RBV, in a tighter pack, before dispersing. The new procedure is in yellow, being dubbed the "JFK Wrap", bringing them over the top in more open airspace and gets them onto their jet airways at a higher altitude with speed. GET OUTTA TOWN!



    There is also a provision that keeps Washington Dulles (KIAD) inbound traffic away from the paths of NY flights as it goes through our area.

    This is "Stage 2B" of the airspace redesign for the area. Stages 3 and 4 will be coming over the next year or two, blending airspace between NY Metro and Philly. Whereas areas that different TRACONs overlap, there is a consolidation that will allow easier communication and transition between coverage zones. One example is the cooperation of NY and Philly. The two areas used to be in separate zones, with a boundary that kept each other's airspace restrictive and cramped. By teaming these "cousin" controllers together and letting them work alongside each other from a physical and technical perspective, they can operate more easily through each other's airspace, giving themselves (and the planes) more breathing room.
    Email me anytime at [email protected].

  12. #12
    Senior Member hiss srq's Avatar
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    On southbound routings it is going to add 15 mins though which is a bummer.
    Southwest Airlines-"Once it pop's it's time to stop" Southwest Airlines-"Our Shamu's are almost real" Southwest Airlines -"We blow our top real easy" Southwest Airlines- "You can't top us..... really"

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by hiss srq View Post
    On southbound routings it is going to add 15 mins though which is a bummer.
    For an airline like jetBlue that could add an incredible amount of fuel expense me thinks !

  14. #14
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    Hi all,

    I just noticed you all talking about this, so I went to www.airnav.com to get the scoop and see what the published SID (Standard Instrument Departure) looked like on "paper".

    Go to www.airnav.com
    then click on AIRPORTS tab
    then type in: JFK
    once the page has loaded....move towards the bottom 1/4 of the page and you will see the DEEZZ1 (RNAV) **NEW** depicted in 2 pages in .pdf format - one for the RNAV fixes and the other a textual description of the procedure off the various runways.

    Hope that helps a little.
    Jeff
    Chicago, IL

  15. #15
    Administrator PhilDernerJr's Avatar
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    Thanks, Jeff. Someone actually linked to it a few posts up already.
    Email me anytime at [email protected].

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