Given the following, what would you do?

[T-Bird76]

Acadia/Enclave look appealing but research was less than I would have liked. The reliability numbers are low over the long haul. Otherwise, sizewise they'd be great

What research are you doing? Just ran the reports on this car in our fleet system and the long haul reliablity is well abover average.

[Art at ISP]

Yes I thought the Acadia/Enclave was rated pretty good overall...one of my clients has the Acadia and it's pretty nice.

When you're ready to do the heavy negotiating, I gladly offer my services again 8)

On my end, my 2010 Audi A4 has arrived at the port and is expected to be at the dealership the week of July 6th. I can't WAIT.

[mirrodie]

Did a lot of research with Consumers Reports and while Hyundai has a great warranty, their problem rate mirrors GMC and Chysler (as a function of age). Honda and Toyota are both up there, with the Nissan a close second. :borat:

Time for an eye exam???

Cross referencing Consumers reports with Edmunds and KBB.

[mirrodie]

Art, I'll take you up on it.

The Pilot and Highlander are still the top contenders. The GMC Acadia is nice and is still a consideration. But again, Enclave and Acadia ride nice, but long term reliability, (and I think both are only 3 years old) is less than stellar. And although Hyundai was a top contender, their largest one is a bit cramped and long term, again, is less than stellar. Your research may vary.

[Jonesbeach]

We just bought a Highlander three weeks ago and so far we like it. There have been a couple of issues with the dashboard lights, but overall I think it's a pretty nice truck. Before this we had a 2002 Honda CR-V, so the Highlander represents a big bump up in terms of size, but shuttling the kids around required the extra seats.

[Art at ISP]

Hey Mario,

As long as you are considering Highlander, would you think about Hybrid? We have the Lexus RX-400h hybrid, and I average 26-27 mpg in mixed driving. I drove it into NYC yesterday and got almost 29. JoAnn and I went to Montauk a couple of weeks ago and it got 30.

Of course the price of oil may not justify the price delta, but we all know oil will go back up at some point, and hybrids will be hot again.....

[mirrodie]

Thanks Art. I will look into it. Honestly, we tend to hold onto our cars for the long haul, so it may be worth it.

[T-Bird76]

Cross referencing Consumers reports with Edmunds and KBB.

Look at JD Power and Associates...far better and less biased reporting.

[mirrodie]

Oh, I have. I dont think COnsumers Reporrts is biased, as much as there aren't using too many samples. The buy each car and assess.

Kbb.com seems to carry info from JD Power.

Still looking.....

[mirrodie]

So over the last week, we have seen, in real life, but not yet driven,

Honda Pilot, Hyundai Veracruz and Santa Fe, Toyota Highlander, GMC Acadia and Buick Enclave and Chevy Traverse.

Whats amazing is that as HUGE as the Acadia seems compared to the Veracruz and Pilot, once you flip up that 3rd pair of seats, all these cars are essentially the same!

The real difference is in the cavernous interior. The main cabin of the Pilot/highlander/veracruz seems big enough to sit 7/8.

But in comparison, the main cabin of the Traverse/Acadia/enclave sits 7/8 men, all of them the size of football players. So the seats and roof are larger/taller, but once that 3rd row of seats go up, the cargo hold is minimal and quite comparable to the 'asian' competitors I noted.

Having seen them all in hte span of a few days, I think the Hyundais are too small.

Top contenders remain the Traverse, Pilot, Highlander and Acadia.

Where are the deals?

Just realized my lease is up in 39, not 36 months, so we have more time and that pushes any decisions to November.

[mirrodie]

After several test drives today, the Hyundais, while really nicely equipped and with the excellent warranty, are simply too tight on space. Hyundai's are out. (though, if you are on the market, the Genesis is a beautiful automobile)

The Honda Pilot......out unfortunately. Good ride but seating considerations are not ideal.

Drove the Chevy Traverse and its seating and cargo makes it a prime candidate but I do have concerns about reliability.

Still have to drive the Toyota Highlander and GMC Acadia, but, honestly, the Acadia, Traverse, Enclave, are very similar, just at different price points, no? What is the major difference there?

(BTW, Moose, we did look at a minivan............must be a generational thing, but they are totally off our radar.)

[T-Bird76]

Drove the Chevy Traverse and its seating and cargo makes it a prime candidate but I do have concerns about reliability.

Still have to drive the Toyota Highlander and GMC Acadia, but, honestly, the Acadia, Traverse, Enclave, are very similar, just at different price points, no? What is the major difference there?

To address your first point...Mario your concerns are unfounded. Would a fleet manager who manages a fleet of 70 million dollars a year drive an unreliable car? The answer to that question is...no.

Chevy Traverse- Entry level

GMC Arcadia- Mid point

Buick Enclave- High end

The three are the same platform with different exterior and interior trims and options.

[mirrodie]

Tom, I think perhaps your misunderstanding me. Your fleet may very well be reliable, but not the most. I was looking at tops in reliability. And at the end of the day, your fleet is going to be influenced, to some degree, by volume pricing, no?

I noticed you said, "Look at JD Power and Associates...far better and less biased reporting." How are Edmunds, KBB and Consumers Reports biased?


From:

http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/cars ... faq_ov.htm

1.2. How does CR's survey compare with other reliability surveys?
The timeframes used in collecting data also differ among surveys. J.D. Power's IQS is based on the first 90 days of ownership of new vehicles only, and its VDS (Vehicle Dependability Study) is exclusively based on 3-year-old vehicles. CR's survey asks about subscribers' experiences with their vehicles over the course of the previous 12 months and, starting with 2006, CR's survey now covers 10 model years—from brand-new models to models that are 10 years old, providing a more complete profile of the life of a model. Our Predicted Reliability, which forecasts how well a new model is likely to hold up, is based on the cumulative experiences of owners of the three latest model years.


That said, while I do value the Consumers Reports, edmunds, etc, seeing the cars has had the most impact on whats driving our decision.

[T-Bird76]

Tom, I think perhaps your misunderstanding me. Your fleet may very well be reliable, but not the most. I was looking at tops in reliability. And at the end of the day, your fleet is going to be influenced, to some degree, by volume pricing, no?

Our fleet is not made up of Arcadias, our fleet manager drives one based on what he knows of its build quality, btw he looked at the Highlander, great car but talk to me when you try to remove the third row seat. Your putting to much stock into Consumer Reports...the same magazine who takes two vacuums cleaners made by the same OEM with different retail labels and reviews one as crap and one as fantastic.

[mirrodie]

Our fleet is not made up of Arcadias

I didnt say that. However, its usually the case that while a fleet mgr looks at lots of variables, I know that once the top, say, 3 contenders are considered, at some point its who is gonna give the best price.

based on what he knows of its build quality, btw he looked at the Highlander, great car but talk to me when you try to remove the third row seat

.

why would I want to remove the 3rd row seat?????

Seats and the set up are a huge consideration, hence the need to get out there and kick the tires.

Your putting to much stock into Consumer Report

Not at all, but its a good first start. Then we went to Edmunds and Kbb and finally narrowed it down to 6 choices to test drive.
But to back my point, to look at the long term reliability, CR is a better resource based on what data they collect.

made by the same OEM

Which, BTW, has us considering the Chevy Traverse over the GMC Acadia. Same Lambda platform, just variations on bells and whistles, which are pretty unnecessary for us.