Rudy on Fox News (What experience does Hillary have?)

[T-Bird76]

I'm not saying the Gov't should sit back and do nothing by all means companies like Walmart should be made to offer health insurance. Suffolk country recently passed a bill stating companies that do business in Suffolk must provide somekind of health coverage.

In theory, I really like this idea, because it forces private enterprise to come up with a solution. But in practice it ends up being a tax on businesses. And it's a heavily regressive tax, because the cost increases on a linear basis as the number of employees increases, but overall company revenues generally increase much more rapidly than that as the number of employees increases. So small businesses would see their costs, as a total percentage of revenue, increase much more than large businesses, and small companies are overtaxed as it is.

Suffolk did it as a direct result of Walmart's practices, that's why companies like Walmart have to be held to higher standards because their decissions truly do impact the economy and culture of our soceity.

[Midnight Mike]

I can agree that there are problems with the Canadian system, but we need to figure out a way to take care of people that don't have insurance.

Deadbeat or not, I think that everyone should have a RIGHT to medical care. It should be in the Constitution. How to acheive that....well that's the tough part.

15% - 20% of the people in the United States do not have health insurance, out of the people, there are a certain number that choose not to have health insurance....

Simple little things like giving tax cuts or tax rebates to cover the cost of purchasing health insurance on the market may be a simple solution....

I was a Contract worker for a while & my company paid me & said if you want to get your own health insurance here is the money, I was young & healthy guess what I did......

As to the rising cost of health care, blame those silly lawsuits that you read so much about & doctors that are overperscribing medication..... Tort reform would bring down costs...

Look at Ambulance chasers like John Edwards getting rich off of frivoulus lawsuits.....

Where is T-Bird, this is arena of knowledge? :D

[Tom_Turner]

I remember the first 100 days when Rudy was Mayor, when he took over from Dinkins, he showed results.....

Rudy did things no one could do as Mayor...people thought it was not possible. Not just the hopelessly incompetent Dinkins Administration, but the Kochatollah and previous adminsitrations as well.

It was a "Rudy Awakening" as they said at the time. :D

[Tom_Turner]

I need to do more research on her statements.

Granted, her healthcare plans ARE flat out socialist. However, healthcare is the only thing that I think does need a socialist twist to it.

The only other Socialist idea I heard of hers was when she said that we should take money away from the oil companies. But I don't know if that was just a spontaneous stupid statement of hers, or if she's said that repeatedly said and truly belives. I also don't know if she's said other things. Anyone?

Phil, she was an advocate for writing legislation to make presidential elections into a popular vote..which on the face of it sounds good to a grade school class, but it undermines our system of representative govt.

The creeping socialism is one thing, but the demagoguery is another..granted its become standard fare for just about all politicians these days, but she distinguishes herself in this category. She (her husband) was instrumental, I am sure, in getting the Feds to hammer the NYPD on bias issues, profiling etc. when per capita many cities run by Democrats had easily worse records of their police gunning down citizens etc.

She wanted Amnesty for terrorists involved in shooting up congress no less....

Thats not even factoring in the Cattle futures windfall, the Subpoenaed records "discovered" on her desk, the bar bouncer collecting Republican politicians FBI files (and no one knows who hired him?) ...its hard to keep track of it all.. and thats without factoring in obscure Whitewater issues, Vince Foster and the like...

She's a hard worker, no doubt..and pretty damn smart....but I can't tell you what she really believes in...except that it runs a high risk of being HARD LEFT once she is unfettered by voters...

Granted Guiliani is changing his positions to gain election and on those issues of particular concern to a given voter, thats disturbing/disappointing, but from my point of view, its fairly transparent why he's flipping, but once in office, he always spoke his mind, answered and explained positions with great candor..I cannot say the same for her.. nearly her entire public record in my opinion is one of political deception.

Tom

[Tom_Turner]

Rudy's experience, though not on a national level, shows good leadership and the ability to manage through problems and make decisions.

Yes, and I would hazard a guess that the city's budget is bigger and rather more complicated than that of Arkansas.

Locally, we've seen D'amato as Senator and Pataki as Governor... and you know, its all a joke.
Most people, if they never opened a newspaper or watched TV etc. wouldn't have known the difference than when their predecessors were in office...

The real deal was Rudy.

Tom

[Tom_Turner]

I don't believe we have ever elected a president whose last office was mayor, and we haven't elected a senator as president since Kennedy.

True..but we never elected a Catholic before Kennedy, an actor before Reagan and a woman before...well... you know... :D

Sheesh..with what New York Senators have become...I just don't know. I watch Senator Schumer and my jaw drops to the floor.

If he wanted to spend all his time at the level of making sure the proper pricing was on tuna fish cans at the local bodega, he should have run for Mark Green's old job.

Tom

[adam613]

What amazes me about Schumer is that even the Republicans upstate voted for him last time around. I never understood the appeal of that man, other than that he's a good politician.

And what amazes me about Clinton is that she makes the Republicans nervous because she's too liberal, and she makes Democrats nervous because she's too conservative. I suspect that the Republicans are really nervous because they know their usual character assassination **** isn't going to go far with her (especially against Giuliani, who has plenty of his own skeletons in his closet). And are really nervous because they have no idea who she really is.

And it's going to be an odd election if Giuliani and Clinton get the major-party nominations, because let's face it, people outside of New York don't really trust New Yorkers.

[Tom_Turner]

Good points Adam.

I think the interesting thing is I suspect both Hillary Clinton and Rudy Guiliani anticipate *changing* the country and getting a mandate to do just that. [Don't be fooled by Billary's record previously..the goal before was always to get re-elected and that superceded everything]..but unless the winner really gets bold in anticipating lots of compromises to get a 2nd term..and its lame duck time anyway before you know it, they're going to go for it right away.

Well, it might be for better or worse, but change is coming. I think the Democrats would be happy just to win, and worry about Hillary later. Certainly the Senate treated Bill very poorly and if it were not for his brilliant political skills and "triangulating" seeming "republican" issues he would've evaporated into irrelevance.

The Republicans can certainly be worried about Guiliani, but they were never going to get their core social "conservative" prayers answered with even Ronald Reagan, much less the two Bushes... and not even Fred Thompson is going to turn back the clock for them (though he might make them feel better), but whatever happens big CHANGE is coming America's way. The Republicans are not going to win presidential elections with walking cadavers like Bob Dole taking their awaited turns... in terms of strategy one would think the Republicans are not going to be able to simply wave the flag and assume votes at Democrats' expense, and the Democrats won't simply imply "racism" and Class Warfare and automatically expect just enough folks to buy it either. But then again, both Hillary and Rudy are getting their feet wet along just those lines, so we'll see. I suspect when we get down to just two candidates some "new" (real) issues might just make the difference for one of them.

Tom

[Tom_Turner]

We live in a Capital society; high quality healthcare is available to everyone in this country through quality employers. Why is it my problem or yours that someone doesn't have healthcare? I just don't understand why I should pay for a total strangers healthcare costs? My healthcare costs are already high enough and I have great insurance. The only way of giving our nation healthcare is to raise taxes to unacceptably high rates which would have a dramatic effect on the economy.

Tommy, I do enjoy these more "extreme" positions... My heart was bleeding liberal blood just like Phil's on this issue, but if I can just stop paying for public education and let parents pay for their own kids (strangers to me after all) maybe we can get something going here.... :borat:

Tom

[Matt Molnar]

Another terrifying Hillary fact: her campaign denies it, but Sandy Berger seems to have a role advising her on national security issues. I hope he brings the 9/11 docs he stole in his sock to those meetings.

How bad is it that I'm hoping Al Gore runs?

[Midnight Mike]

Another terrifying Hillary fact: her campaign denies it, but Sandy Berger seems to have a role advising her on national security issues. I hope he brings the 9/11 docs he stole in his sock to those meetings.

How bad is it that I'm hoping Al Gore runs?

That is pretty bad wishing for Al Gore! :mrgreen:

[adam613]

How bad is it that I'm hoping Al Gore runs?

It's sorta like me wishing GWB could be more like his father... :)

[T-Bird76]

[quote=Tom_Turner]

We live in a Capital society; high quality healthcare is available to everyone in this country through quality employers. Why is it my problem or yours that someone doesn't have healthcare? I just don't understand why I should pay for a total strangers healthcare costs? My healthcare costs are already high enough and I have great insurance. The only way of giving our nation healthcare is to raise taxes to unacceptably high rates which would have a dramatic effect on the economy.

Tommy, I do enjoy these more "extreme" positions... My heart was bleeding liberal blood just like Phil's on this issue, but if I can just stop paying for public education and let parents pay for their own kids (strangers to me after all) maybe we can get something going here.... :borat:

Tom[/quote:7931c]

Tom its apples and oranges when it comes to public healthcare for all and free education. Education is the path to success and prosperity which will better society far more then giving free health care to people who have no desire to better themselves. I'm far more supportive to raising taxes to better our education system then giving non deserving individuals free healthcare. Children should be given every opportunity to receive a high quality education that will help them choose their path in life. Chances are if they are educated members of society they'll take the right path, get a good job that will give them good health insurance and you and I will not have to pay for it.

[Tom_Turner]

Tom its apples and oranges when it comes to public healthcare for all and free education. Education is the path to success and prosperity which will better society far more then giving free health care to people who have no desire to better themselves. I'm far more supportive to raising taxes to better our education system then giving non deserving individuals free healthcare. Children should be given every opportunity to receive a high quality education that will help them choose their path in life. Chances are if they are educated members of society they'll take the right path, get a good job that will give them good health insurance and you and I will not have to pay for it.

Yeah, thats right, but it is a socialized system (and not as good as it once was). Lets at least have a voucher program then. As it stands now, there is not much reason to believe shoveling more money into public education is going to get better results. Unless I believe benefiting the Teachers Union is in some way helping children. Also, I am not really getting the benefit of fairly wealthy communities enjoying free education when I suspect they'd look after their kids best interests any way, and the areas more likely to produce criminal populations have the worst schools. (yeah, I know, lets increase the teachers pay and it will all go away...heh heh..right). [Seriously though, free education is fine with me...although I am not sure we sure we should pay for adults to spend years alternating basket weaving and remedial math and reading at "colleges" - at significant tax payer expense... we should expect good grades and relevant subjects]

Also, back on topic, we've had a good run of decades in terms of National Health issues. By many reports Super Bugs are just around the corner and at that pont, when someone gets sick with one it may very well be important to both you and I that they are treated as best as possible.

Tom

[T-Bird76]

[quote=Tom_Turner]

Tom its apples and oranges when it comes to public healthcare for all and free education. Education is the path to success and prosperity which will better society far more then giving free health care to people who have no desire to better themselves. I'm far more supportive to raising taxes to better our education system then giving non deserving individuals free healthcare. Children should be given every opportunity to receive a high quality education that will help them choose their path in life. Chances are if they are educated members of society they'll take the right path, get a good job that will give them good health insurance and you and I will not have to pay for it.

Yeah, thats right, but it is a socialized system (and not as good as it once was). Lets at least have a voucher program then. As it stands now, there is not much reason to believe shoveling more money into public education is going to get better results. Unless I believe benefiting the Teachers Union is in some way helping children. Also, I am not really getting the benefit of fairly wealthy communities enjoying free education when I suspect they'd look after their kids best interests any way, and the areas more likely to produce criminal populations have the worst schools. (yeah, I know, lets increase the teachers pay and it will all go away...heh heh..right). [Seriously though, free education is fine with me...although I am not sure we sure we should pay for adults to spend years alternating basket weaving and remedial math and reading at "colleges" - at significant tax payer expense... we should expect good grades and relevant subjects]

Also, back on topic, we've had a good run of decades in terms of National Health issues. By many reports Super Bugs are just around the corner and at that pont, when someone gets sick with one it may very well be important to both you and I that they are treated as best as possible.

Tom[/quote:00e3c]

All you have to do is dump tenue and put some real standars in place. What's wrong with a super bug or two? Its the Earth's way of keeping the population in check ;)