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Thread: Your Thoughts

  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by NIKV69
    So why do you or any of us upload then? Why do you sell slides? If this hobby is just about shooting pics we like to look at and the friends around us when we shoot them why do we go home and edit and upload them? Mike I get enjoyment from all aspects of the hobby, going to the airport, taking the pics, the people that share the hobby with me. BUT, I also enjoy people looking at my pics, adding them to their albums, emailing me to buy prints, even when someone here at work looks at a pic of mine on the screen and likes it. It's all part of the equation. I don't know why people have to deny this fact and proclaim it's just about the people and your own satisfaction but I don't buy it. The facts on both the two big sites (anet and JP) say otherwise.
    That's the thing Nick. I've been doing this for many many years before ANET/Jetphotos and will do it for years (if I'm still alive) after. You could tell me that I can never sell/trade a slide ever again or never upload/show a picture to anyone and you know what, I'd still shoot 80 rolls of Kodachrome on a outing at LAX/MIA/whereever. Why? I f'in enjoy it. I work my butt off during the week, I care and support a wife and 3 kids and it's my way of relaxing. It's nice to have but I don't need ANET/Jetphotos/My site/any other site to still enjoy this hobby.

    Sure, I upload to share my photos and love doing so but I DO NOT shoot only because of ANET/Jetphotos/uploading like a lot of people do. If those sites shut down today, I would still be shooting like always, nothing at all would change because I do this for me, myself and I. You have to remember, I started shooting (like some of us here) waaaaay before the internet and uploading pics. No one is saying that uploading is not part of the enjoyment nowadays but for the true enthusiast it's NOT the only enjoyment.

    Now, to more important things...when the F are we going to meet up and shoot :)

    Mike

  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by T-Bird76
    b) to have Anets highest rejection rate.
    Mario my good friend you have achieved the ultimate rejection anyone on this earth that has ever wanted to upload a shot to A.net. I quote Johan "The photo is crap." That is a badge of honor that you should wear proudly!
    Mario is too modest to show his award certificate so let me do the honors... :lol:



    Mike

  3. #18
    Moderator mirrodie's Avatar
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    Sniff, sniff,....I,... I,

    I don't know what to say.


    YOu like me, you really like me.
    And I, I took the path less traveled by
    and that has made all the difference......yet...
    I have a feeling a handle of people are going to be very interested in what I post in the near future.

    http://www.jetphotos.net/showphotos.php?userid=187

  4. #19
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    Hahahah! And I'd like to present the post of the week award to Mike McLaughlin! :)

  5. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by mirrodie
    Sniff, sniff,....I,... I,

    I don't know what to say.
    YOu like me, you really like me.
    What's not to like. Anyone who takes great pics is okay in my book. Even guys like Nick who can't take great pics are cool ;)

    Quote Originally Posted by Nick
    I never said you had to. I just wish we would be a little more truthful about this topic. There is nothing wrong with uploading to anet or JP but be honest. We all get a level of satisfaction when our pic gets accepted and then takes the next step and gets a lot of hits. Then the ultimate step of getting a request to buy it. We all strive for this and it's ok to do so in addition to enjoying the people and your own photos.
    Who's not being truthful? I never said uploading, getting the hits, etc. is not fun/satisifing but (to me) it's not everything. I'm just saying don't base your whole hobby/shooting style around it, that's all.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nick
    Whenever I get an invite!
    What are you doing early Sunday morning? I might go out and grab a few arrivals depending on which runway is in use. Call me.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nick
    Mike get is right. Johan called it an "incredible crappy photo"!
    Corrected, hit refresh :)

    Mike

  6. #21
    Senior Member NIKV69's Avatar
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    Well it's nice to see a long post that I took the time to write out has been deleted and the email I got gave me a multiple of reasons but was not very specific. Once again I find this whole anet database issue to be tiring. In the email I got from the mods there was a quote from someone that responded to me that seems to think that the anet DB is full of pics that are only in the DB cause they have been photoshopped to death. If that is the thinking well I will just cease to bother to voice my opinions. It seems that anet will always be the target of people here and be accused of being bad for photogs and bad for the reasons we shoot but like I have said the fact remains that everyone uses anet as their primary place to upload photos. Seems very hypocritical to me. I will cease to voice my opinion because it has become a waste of time, time which I can be using to go shoot and edit and enjoy the hobby in my own way.

    Cheers.
    'My idea of a good picture is one that's in focus and of a famous person doing something unfamous.' Andy Warhol

  7. #22
    Moderator mirrodie's Avatar
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    Yeah Nik, sorry about that.

    Talking specifics, realize that when I moderate on Anet and here, the templates are different and sometimes confusing. So when I went to reply to your post, I ended up toolishly typing OVER what you wrote. SNAFU.

    mea culpa.


    Back on topic, I wrote that I agree that anet demands certain things. BUT

    You say high quality photos and that is where I disagree. Anet does not want high quality photos as much as it demands quality photos that are PSed to a certain standard. That is a fact. There are a large amount of high quality photos that are rejected because they are not photoshopped in a way that Anet likes. Sorry but that is fact.

    And to support that fact:
    I'll prove that very simply....I've uploaded a photo, had it rejected for soft just changed how it was PSed and it was accepted. That supports what I am saying.

    The quality of the photoshopping was key, not the quality of the photo.


    Nik, I don't give a toss about it anymore but here is one other thing to consider. Maybe some of the users here post their feelings about Anet just to get a rise out of you, since you think the sun rises and sets down in Anets and Johans pants?? ;)

    I think we just like getting a Nik rant every once in a while
    And I, I took the path less traveled by
    and that has made all the difference......yet...
    I have a feeling a handle of people are going to be very interested in what I post in the near future.

    http://www.jetphotos.net/showphotos.php?userid=187

  8. #23
    Senior Member NIKV69's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mirrodie
    Talking specifics, realize that when I moderate on Anet and here, the templates are different and sometimes confusing. So when I went to reply to your post, I ended up toolishly typing OVER what you wrote. SNAFU
    That's great but I still have no idea what you are talking about or why my post was deleted.



    Quote Originally Posted by mirrodie
    Nik, I don't give a toss about it anymore but here is one other thing to consider. Maybe some of the users here post their feelings about Anet just to get a rise out of you, since you think the sun rises and sets down in Anets and Johans pants??
    I don't think the sun rises and shines off of anyone, I just accept the fact that it is the best site of it's kind and that everyone here uploads there. The fact that the site would like you to level and remove some dustspots in addition to sharpening doesn't mean that the site doesn't want your pictures. Why was PS created? To do the same thing airbrushng and other methods of improving pictures shot on film was. Nothing more. Every magazine did these same things to pictures taken on film before the boom of digital. They just want the best possible pic. Doesn't mean they are discouraging photography or people adding their photos.
    'My idea of a good picture is one that's in focus and of a famous person doing something unfamous.' Andy Warhol

  9. #24
    Administrator PhilDernerJr's Avatar
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    Nick, I sent you an email explaning it more detail. If you have further questions based on that, please just reply and I'll try help you as best as I can.
    Email me anytime at [email protected].

  10. #25
    Moderator mirrodie's Avatar
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    I love you Nick, you are so passionate and protective of Anet :)


    relax, we enjoy the occasional Nick rant just as much as you enjoyed "Moon Over Maho Beach."

    up for shooting this Monday?
    And I, I took the path less traveled by
    and that has made all the difference......yet...
    I have a feeling a handle of people are going to be very interested in what I post in the near future.

    http://www.jetphotos.net/showphotos.php?userid=187

  11. #26
    Administrator PhilDernerJr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NIKV69
    It seems that anet will always be the target of people here and be accused of being bad for photogs and bad for the reasons we shoot but like I have said the fact remains that everyone uses anet as their primary place to upload photos.
    Whenever you have anything that involves rejections of any kind, you're going ot get complaints, no matter what amazing rules Anet implements. There iwll always be rejections and everyone will have something to say about them.
    Email me anytime at [email protected].

  12. #27
    Senior Member Tom_Turner's Avatar
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    [quote="NIKV69"]

    <<Whether we care to admit it Tom. (And most of us won't) One of the bigger reasons anyone takes pictures is so that people will look at them and like them. If this wasn't the case, and we all just shot "for personal enjoyment" then none of us would upload to anet or JP and none of us would post the links to our pictures in the sticky thread here the minute they get accepted. >>

    I don't post in the "sticky" thread.. :) but I did notice in looking up the outside links to my images on A.net, that NYCAv does generate decent traffic to A.net shots.

    I think you make a fair point Nick. But, "Personal enjoyment" *is* how alot of guys got started that like aviation and bought a cheap camera and went to airports to take some pictures for themselves. (Heck, I still occasionally meet guys, even these days around JFK, LGA and EWR that still shoot prints and they don't have access to the internet at all).

    Since then, well, Al Gore created the Internet.

    And Digital photography made taking "good" pictures easier.

    I will admit being highly motivated by A.net over the years. (I had to be...considering my mountain of rejections..:) ) However, the initial reason was seeing what nice work the NYCBoyz were doing, but that had to do generally with the internet, not exclusively A.net. Alot of the "old timers" had their own personal sites back around the time of A.net's inception.

    Yes, A.net did inspire me to start shooting.

    However, I was basically a dedicated spotter since 1968.

    <<Tom you can share your passion for this hobby without uploading the same aircraft five times from the same airport at the same spot at the same angle.>>

    No doubt about that Nick. I think we are in agreement :)

    Without travelling though, I will take our area as the example I would know best....and suggest that the "spots" around JFK/LGA/EWR are limited. There are some variations, but we're looking at similar shots..and not only that, at one time most of the spots used now actually had to be "found". There are a set of folks that "discovered" those spots in recent years, and before that most of those spots (or similar) were "discovered" previously. It's kinda like Christopher Columbus...was he first? :)

    But in any event, it wasn't simply a case of logging into A.net/JP/NYCAv/Photovation etc. and have 15 guys every weekend converge on known spots - thats contributing to the mass uploading people here are expressing displeasure in seeing and I suppose depressing more selective shots.

    A.net is popular; the hobby keeps growing. Does it matter if one guy uploads 50 shots from one day, or 5 guys upload 10 shots each from the same day?

    We can wish all we want that there should be 200 hundred folks show up at Planeview and then think they shouldn't upload their shots, but guess what.... if NYCAviation and the Port Authority sponsored a bus tour every weekend of the ramps at JFK and LGA you'd have the same result on the ramp as you see from the perimeter. And, if we ever get viewing terraces open again, you'll see the same thing there.

    But what is the alternative? Not help people out? Show people spots and give them contacts on the understanding they won't upload in mass?

    Does it become pointless then to upload alot similar shots?... yeah, its begging the question, I agree... One of the reasons I do alot of Maritime Photography in my spare time now instead and I still am inspired to shoot at the heliports. JFK and LGA seem in good hands these days...even amongst the "boring" shots, people are kicking ass out there now.

    <<Come on. I see photogs that do this and it has nothing to do with anything but driving up pic count for status.>>

    Maybe your right. Or maybe they want to make photo sales... I don't know..

    <<I am surprised the anet screeners even allow that.>>

    You can't underestimate the vanity factor. If A.net drives 600 newbies into uploading elsewhere guess what happens? Those photographers will go elsewhere to genuflect upon their creations....

    <<You know what Tom. You don't have to shoot everything that goes by. You can actually put the camera down when the same B6 scarebus goes by that you have seen half a million times.>>

    Hey, my camera's shutter is not broken since I bought it in 2001. There's a reason for that... :)

    << How fun would the DB be if everyone uploaded everything they shot? There would be so much WN and B6 and other boring stuff>>

    I don't disagree really.. and Amsterdam, St Maarten, Heathrow..and JFK/LGA nowadays...its all arguably "overshot". Hard to say where's its all going.

    <<I don't know why people have to deny this fact and proclaim it's just about the people and your own satisfaction but I don't buy it. The facts on both the two big sites (anet and JP) say otherwise.>>

    I go for the planes and not the people..but having said that, my trips out to JFK were sparse this summer..and three of the best times were hanging out with you at Howard Beach, Mario at the cargo area, and Phil & Tommy at Bayswater... short and sweet to be sure. but those were nice times.
    "Keep 'em Flying"

  13. #28
    Senior Member Tom_Turner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NIKV69

    [How fun would the DB be if everyone uploaded everything they shot? There would be so much WN and B6 and other boring stuff there wouldn't be enough time in the day to look at anything. Not to mention the queue would be 20000 pics to be screened at any given time.
    Well, thats ironically perhaps how other sites (JP, ATI etc), are one of the best things that ever happened to A.net. The popularity of the hobby as it relates to uploading shots to the internet just exploded.. If JP or similar did not exist, the sheet volume of dropped into the upload queue would be unmanagable. and, too, you'd have hundreds of disgruntled moaning, whining attacks on the screeners, demands that things be done differently and all the rest you already have, but it'd be magnified beyond belief. Either that, or shots would be added every minute, and no views due to absolute saturation.. :)

    Its a compliment to A.net as well, that its influence is so strong, much is simply a copy of that site in terms of content.. as you say, much of it is just common sense and wisdom.. level the horizon and so on...that helped improve many of us in some basic skills...but I still feel an opportunity may have been lost in there somewhere for an alternative...slightly different emphasis in aesthetics....but thats another topic..
    "Keep 'em Flying"

  14. #29
    Administrator PhilDernerJr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NIKV69
    I see photogs that do this and it has nothing to do with anything but driving up pic count for status. I am surprised the anet screeners even allow that.
    Quote Originally Posted by NIKV69
    Tom you can share your passion for this hobby without uploading the same aircraft five times from the same airport at the same spot at the same angle.
    Quote Originally Posted by NIKV69
    The facts on both the two big sites (anet and JP) say otherwise.
    What “facts” are you talking about when you say it's obvious they do it only for status? Status of what?

    Honestly, Nick, you always seem to go back to the hits and Anet status stuff. There are many other reasons that people upload their photos.

    Like Tom Turner said, maybe they are looking for photo sales. I've seen and I would call it fact that the more you upload and the more recent you keep your portfolio on the databases, the more sales you'll get.

    Either way, it shouldn't have to be explained. I don't see what the actual PROBLEM is with someone posting for example, a shot of N504JB from a rear 3/4 angle from the cargo area on multiple days.

    Does it hurt anyone in any way? Why does it bother you so much? If you think it’s boring, then don’t click on it.

    Quote Originally Posted by NIKV69
    I don't know why people … proclaim it's just about the people and your own satisfaction but I don't buy it.
    Why don’t you buy it? If Anet didn’t exist, I’d still take pics, and I’m sure almost everyone else here would, too. Do you think we’re all lying?
    Email me anytime at [email protected].

  15. #30
    Senior Member NIKV69's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by phil d
    What “facts” are you talking about when you say it's obvious they do it only for status? Status of what?
    Come on Phil. You just the other day used the famous. "How many pics do you have on anet?" Ever since I met the area group this phrase has been used as a way to give credibilty to peoples opinions on anet, how anet screens etc. I am not saying you personally do this but your remark in that thread the other day on anet whether consciously or unconsciously is used in this fashion. In fact my first slide show dinner I was asked how many pics I had in the DB by someone who shall remain nameless. This was asked while the person asking knew the answer already. Plenty around here know that for a few people around here total pics in the anet DB equals some sort of higher status. If you don't know the meaning of the word "status" in this context I can't help you, but this thinking is total BS. If you also don't see the problem with someone uploading the same pic of shades of blue from the same angle sitting on the ramp multiple times well again I can't help you. It wastes space, screeners screening time and our time. There are thousands of other planes out there and 400 other B6 AC to shoot. Go shoot them.
    'My idea of a good picture is one that's in focus and of a famous person doing something unfamous.' Andy Warhol

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