2-3-13 JFK T5 .. YES AGAIN

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2013-02-18, 11:32 PM
megatop412

Quote:

Originally Posted by snydersnapshots

Though I've been taking pictures as a pilot for over 30 years, when it comes to spotting and taking pictures I'm a relative newbie. Having said that, I'm going to throw out my two-cents worth and I'd like your opinions.

Is there a non-emergency number for the actual PA police to say "I'm at T5 taking photos, I'll be there from XX PM to YY PM, I'm driving such and such a vehicle, and I'm wearing bermuda shorts, a western shirt, and cowboy boots By the way, what was your name again?" (and they say an airline pilot's wardrobe is the best birth control method known to man...)

I was spotting in Houston with a guy who does it on a regular basis and he called the Airport Operations folks and we gave them our vehicle info, location, and the times we were going to be there....

If you could do that, then when/if security comes around, you could either call the PA police yourself or tell them to call--giving them the number and the name of the person you talked to. Best case, you piss them off because you headed them off at the pass. Worst case, the security calls the cops, the cops take you in, and you give them the name of the person you talked to. Maybe a simplistic and logical look at things in a jurisdiction where simplicity and logic aren't part of the equation.

I've asked that here before and gotten the answer that essentially, what works in Boston ain't gonna work at Kennedy(you can call up in Boston if you're going to be on their garage and apparently it makes a difference).
2013-02-18, 11:52 PM
NIKV69

Quote:

Originally Posted by Phil D.

Oh, and if you end up leaving as a result of a guard telling you...tell her that you would like her to escort you out, as you refuse to pay for parking if you are being told to leave for doing something that is not against any actual rules.

I would love to have the first person here who attempts this to post the result.
2013-02-19, 01:27 AM
PhilDernerJr

My opinion is that if the spotter presses the security guard to that, that it will hold them to the fire and have them say "Forget it...you can stay here". My PERSONAL opinion is that if YOU try to escalate it, they will back down. I could be very wrong though. There is risk in some capacity on many sides.
2013-02-19, 01:49 AM
RomNYC

Quote:

Originally Posted by Phil D.

My opinion is that if the spotter presses the security guard to that, that it will hold them to the fire and have them say "Forget it...you can stay here". My PERSONAL opinion is that if YOU try to escalate it, they will back down. I could be very wrong though. There is risk in some capacity on many sides.

I perfectly understand your arguments Phil, and I fully believe you are right. However this is where I draw the line between having a hobby and fighting for it. I'm gonna sound selfish as hell, but spotting is a way for me to relax after a week of work. I watch the planes, take my photos, whatever. If I have to FIGHT for it, then I'm not interested anymore, especially given that it is only involving ONE location, which I believe everyone here agreed on keeping quiet 2 years ago. I believe we still have plenty of locations to enjoy our hobby from and that, as megatop412 previously said, this situation is getting out of hand. If we are to get upset about it, then this hobby is not a hobby. It feels like work... Actually no, at least I can control what I do at work... A luxury I don't have at John Fitzgerald Kennedy International Airport.

Phil, though, I ADMIRE you for doing everything you do for our community. You show amazing deals of energy, patience, and conviction in trying to solve this issue for us, not you, US. I applaud you for this, and everything else you do with NYCA.

I just think a lot of people are getting upset here. And I believe this should not happen. It is *just* a hobby.
2013-02-19, 04:09 AM
NIKV69

Quote:

Originally Posted by Phil D.

My opinion is that if the spotter presses the security guard to that, that it will hold them to the fire and have them say "Forget it...you can stay here". My PERSONAL opinion is that if YOU try to escalate it, they will back down. I could be very wrong though. There is risk in some capacity on many sides.

Mark Z has already established that with his "Show me the policy" episode. Going forward though it will only work on a case by case basis. These encounters will still happen from time to time though. Until a better relationship is developed with security guards and Port. Escalating things and demanding not paying the parking fee will only set this back.
2013-02-19, 08:18 AM
hiss srq

Nick, I doubt it will escelate things, when I return to New York I am going to test this theroy, I am going to pretend to be a civillian, hide all of my security credentials and take my shield out of my wallet and see if me and Phil's theroy is correct.
2013-02-19, 10:29 AM
megatop412

Rom you are right in the end we are all just enjoying a hobby and it shouldn't have to require a struggle like this to enjoy it, which for some will make it not worth the effort. I just hate that circumstances had to pick the one hobby I feel most passionate about to make a mess out of. You would think that people flying model rockets(which I also enjoyed growing up until I lost the damn thing by using a motor too big for the vehicle I was launching) would have to deal with these sorts of security hassles and not people taking pictures. But for me, the sheer absurdity of it all is what I think propels me to want to fight the fight.
2013-02-19, 02:04 PM
NIKV69

Quote:

Originally Posted by hiss srq

Nick, I doubt it will escelate things, when I return to New York I am going to test this theroy, I am going to pretend to be a civillian, hide all of my security credentials and take my shield out of my wallet and see if me and Phil's theroy is correct.

Get video, this ought to be good. (facepalm)
2013-02-19, 03:39 PM
wunaladreamin

Quote:

Originally Posted by NIKV69

Get video, this ought to be good. (facepalm)

I'll bring the popcorn.
2013-02-19, 04:12 PM
steve1840

Quote:

Originally Posted by wunaladreamin

I'll bring the popcorn.

Count me in for beer, vodka, gin, and tonic water......
2013-02-19, 05:49 PM
Delta777LR

count me in ill have smokes with me lol. well ill have my Newports
2013-02-19, 06:50 PM
PhilDernerJr

I think instigating is a bad thing, though. :-p
2013-02-19, 10:31 PM
NIKV69

Quote:

Originally Posted by Phil D.

I think instigating is a bad thing, though. :-p

I don't see the point of putting a third party with nothing to do with the situation in a spot. The person sitting in the toll booth doesn't need this drama. Especially when it's manufactured. If you want to stand your ground against a rent a cop so be it. Let them call Port. Again Mark's approach was perfect. Hence why it worked.
2013-02-20, 10:30 PM
Delta777LR

Quote:

Originally Posted by NIKV69

I don't see the point of putting a third party with nothing to do with the situation in a spot. The person sitting in the toll booth doesn't need this drama. Especially when it's manufactured. If you want to stand your ground against a rent a cop so be it. Let them call Port. Again Mark's approach was perfect. Hence why it worked.

Tell that to the rent a cops at EWR. first thing first, CF cards confiscated by PAPD LOL
2013-02-25, 07:47 AM
hiss srq

What can they do? And ultimatly I am not just a civillian in any of the capacities so if it escelates I would tell them to sit on a stiff one and walk away anyway... It's FJC security, not secret service and spotting is not a crime. I would hedge my bet that the Port Cop will be more pissed with the"security guard" than me anyway if I didn't obey them.

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