More recent TSA experiences.

[mirrodie]

My office manager just returned with her own TSA issues this weekend.

While they argued with her that she could not bring her contact lens solutions, (she had in hand their webpage with the most current info), they rummaged her bag and yet, somehow ignored her other bag, which had liquid lip gloss and a bottle of H20. :?

And I heard another story, though I didnt get the entire details about TSA theft. Perhaps someone else can fill this bit in?

Of course, lots of this comes down to smoke, mirrors and a lack of money.

Maybe the TSA could save the $$ by getting the big red/green button that some Central American countries use for security.

I am thinking of writing to them with my T-shirt sales and water bottles sales, after the security checkpoint. I think it would generate some well needed $$.

[Matt Molnar]

From Friday's Star-Ledger (http://www.nj.com/search/index.ssf?/base/news-9/1161928940141470.xml?starledger?ntop&coll=1)

Screeners at Newark fail to find 'weapons'
Agents got 20 of 22 'devices' past staff

Screeners at Newark Liberty International Airport failed 20 of 22 security tests conducted by undercover U.S. agents last week, missing an array of concealed bombs and guns at checkpoints throughout the hub's three terminals, federal security officials familiar with the results said.

The tests, conducted Oct. 19 by U.S. Transportation Security Administration "Red Team" agents, also revealed significant failures by screeners to follow standard operating procedures while checking passengers and their baggage for prohibited items, said the officials, who spoke on condition of anonymity because it is against TSA policy to release covert-test results.

and

From today's Star-Ledger (http://www.nj.com/news/ledger/jersey/index.ssf?/base/news-5/116227669134640.xml&coll=1)

TSA seeks source of leaks on airport security tests
Corzine and Pascrell rip probe of Newark Liberty disclosures

Federal authorities have launched an investigation to determine who leaked test results showing security screeners missed 90 percent of the explosives and guns agents attempted to sneak past checkpoints this month at Newark Liberty International Airport.

The probe was launched by the U.S. Transportation Security Administration after The Star-Ledger, citing information from federal security officials, reported Thursday that screeners failed 20 of 22 covert tests and also violated standard operating procedures at the busy hub.

[T-Bird76]

Oh just wait to you read my article for Sunday! I provide my own brand of input on our friends at the TSA. The second article is rather interesting there Matt, can I assume the TSA didn't want those pathetic test results to get out to the public? Can't blame them, why would they want to openly admit they couldn't stop someone taking a Polaris missile through the checkpoint. I swear the TSA is Al Qaeda's best ally.

[emshighway]

Had to check, is this flyertalk Jr?

[T-Bird76]

Had to check, is this flyertalk Jr?

No it isn't, this is a website where people can debate intelligently about issues that bother them. Flyertalk isn't the only website where people have issues about the TSA. EMS face the facts, your organization is filled with problems from the top down. If this was a publically traded company it would either be out of business or the entire board of Directors would be fired by the investors.

There is no excuse what so ever for what went on at EWR. This isn't the first time it happened either at EWR. Instead of making immature comments why not as a representative of the TSA share with us what needs to be done to prevent such a massive failure again. I have to wonder if the same attitude you take here is the same attitude you have while performing your job? Because if it is, god help us all.

[Matt Molnar]

Had to check, is this flyertalk Jr?

Just curious why you take criticisms of the TSA so personally? I know you work for them, but still, we're talking about the organization as a whole, not you.

[i_mizrahi]

This discussion about TSA reminds me my last encounter with them, about 4 weeks ago. Me and my father entered the U.S. in ORD (from MAD). The TSA check was like something taken from a comedy movie. The agent was a HUGE guy, bald as an egg, and when he put the latex glove on his hand I couldn't help but imagine I'm in some kind of a bad sit-com.
Nevertheless, I have much sympathy for those fellows. They work very hard, and no doubt that if something bad happens, they'll take the heat.

[mirrodie]

Had to check, is this flyertalk Jr?

Just curious why you take criticisms of the TSA so personally? I know you work for them, but still, we're talking about the organization as a whole, not you.


I've often wondered that as well.

[RDU-JFK]

A few weekends ago I was at LGA's Central Terminal (concourse C). As I was passing through security I noticed a business traveller reach slightly into the x-ray machine to grab his exiting bag or tray or whatever. I admit, there was a sign that said please do not reach under to retrieve your bags.

The TSA officer told this guy in a loud voice so everyone heard it, "I'm sorry that there's a sign here that says not to reach your hands under here. I'm so sorry the sign clearly states that".

Now, a simple "please do not reach under the sign to retrieve your bags" would have sufficed. I was (as were other travelers) shocked at this comment. No sarcasm necessary.

[emshighway]

Had to check, is this flyertalk Jr?

Just curious why you take criticisms of the TSA so personally? I know you work for them, but still, we're talking about the organization as a whole, not you.

Where in my comment quoted above did I say I was taking this posting personally? Oh, I'm sorry I didn't put a smiley face to indicate the joking manner of my comment.

[emshighway]

A few weekends ago I was at LGA's Central Terminal (concourse C). As I was passing through security I noticed a business traveller reach slightly into the x-ray machine to grab his exiting bag or tray or whatever. I admit, there was a sign that said please do not reach under to retrieve your bags.

The TSA officer told this guy in a loud voice so everyone heard it, "I'm sorry that there's a sign here that says not to reach your hands under here. I'm so sorry the sign clearly states that".

Now, a simple "please do not reach under the sign to retrieve your bags" would have sufficed. I was (as were other travelers) shocked at this comment. No sarcasm necessary.

Yes, the first time someone does it a simple "please adhere to the sign" is appropriate. When it is several hundred and it is obvious the person is ignoring the sign it becomes pretty annoying to have to say it constantly.

[emshighway]

Had to check, is this flyertalk Jr?

No it isn't, this is a website where people can debate intelligently about issues that bother them. Flyertalk isn't the only website where people have issues about the TSA. EMS face the facts, your organization is filled with problems from the top down. If this was a publically traded company it would either be out of business or the entire board of Directors would be fired by the investors.

There is no excuse what so ever for what went on at EWR. This isn't the first time it happened either at EWR. Instead of making immature comments why not as a representative of the TSA share with us what needs to be done to prevent such a massive failure again. I have to wonder if the same attitude you take here is the same attitude you have while performing your job? Because if it is, god help us all.

Not a representative of TSA when I post here. I just a poster who happens to work for TSA.

Yes, there is a difference.

There is also a difference between discussing and bashing. When you all learn how to discuss then I will.

As someone who doesn't know me reserve a comment until you do. And yes god help you.

[T-Bird76]

A few weekends ago I was at LGA's Central Terminal (concourse C). As I was passing through security I noticed a business traveller reach slightly into the x-ray machine to grab his exiting bag or tray or whatever. I admit, there was a sign that said please do not reach under to retrieve your bags.

The TSA officer told this guy in a loud voice so everyone heard it, "I'm sorry that there's a sign here that says not to reach your hands under here. I'm so sorry the sign clearly states that".

Now, a simple "please do not reach under the sign to retrieve your bags" would have sufficed. I was (as were other travelers) shocked at this comment. No sarcasm necessary.

Yes, the first time someone does it a simple "please adhere to the sign" is appropriate. When it is several hundred and it is obvious the person is ignoring the sign it becomes pretty annoying to have to say it constantly.

Did you ever think EMS that the person who reached under the sign 15 mins after the last person has anything to do with the original? No absolutely not. This is just another person in time that made a mistake, yelling at him is unprofessional and serves no purpose but to further the negative image of the TSA. Your right though it does become annoying, but guess what, each of these people have nothing to do with each other, so the need to yell is useless.

When I was in college I worked retail and customer after customer would ask the same "stupid" questions but I knew that each of them was someone totally different asking a genuine question, just as these people are making a genuine mistake. Show your people a video called "Fish." It might just change their attitudes.

[mirrodie]

When you all learn how to discuss then I will.


No one here is bashing the TSA. Note how you say when "you all learn".

So what, you think we are all bashing the TSA? Interesting how everyone seems to have nothing but the same negative sentiment. That is not bashing, that is "we all" sharing our same similar experiences. If I follow your logic, unless its positive feedback, what, its supposedly bashing???

Bashing is a matter of perception. But since the organization in question has yielded many negative sentiments over a large diverse span of people, maybe then your perception of bashing is really nothing more than us discussing the flaws inherent in the system.

Furthermore, yes, bashing was weeks ago when I called the TSA a bunch of tools. There was an apology and all the discussions since have been discussions.


If I recall correctly, you did say "We are trying the best we can" only to state later, "the rest is just smoke and mirrors" Sorry but as an individual that loves science, I can see through the illusion.

If we are all spending $10 a roundtrip for better security, then we the consumer have a right to question the actions bestowed upon us. Unfortunately, your perception that we are all bashing the TSA is flawed.

[emshighway]

When you all learn how to discuss then I will.


No one here is bashing the TSA. Note how you say when "you all learn".

So what, you think we are all bashing the TSA? Interesting how everyone seems to have nothing but the same negative sentiment. That is not bashing, that is "we all" sharing our same similar experiences. If I follow your logic, unless its positive feedback, what, its supposedly bashing???

Bashing is a matter of perception. But since the organization in question has yielded many negative sentiments over a large diverse span of people, maybe then your perception of bashing is really nothing more than us discussing the flaws inherent in the system.

Furthermore, yes, bashing was weeks ago when I called the TSA a bunch of tools. There was an apology and all the discussions since have been discussions.


If I recall correctly, you did say "We are trying the best we can" only to state later, "the rest is just smoke and mirrors" Sorry but as an individual that loves science, I can see through the illusion.

If we are all spending $10 a roundtrip for better security, then we the consumer have a right to question the actions bestowed upon us. Unfortunately, your perception that we are all bashing the TSA is flawed.

As you stated your perception not mine. Don't like the "you" being used? Neither do I.

Paraphrasing the smoke and mirrors to the max I see.

"The TSA officer told this guy in a loud voice so everyone heard it" I believe this can be called projecting. :roll:

"Oh just wait to you read my article for Sunday! I provide my own brand of input on our friends at the TSA"

"I swear the TSA is Al Qaeda's best ally"

"Maybe the TSA could save the $$ by getting the big red/green button that some Central American countries use for security."

Yea, not bashing, right.

See you are jumping on policy issues which the people at the local airports have very little control over.

[T-Bird76]

When you all learn how to discuss then I will.


No one here is bashing the TSA. Note how you say when "you all learn".

So what, you think we are all bashing the TSA? Interesting how everyone seems to have nothing but the same negative sentiment. That is not bashing, that is "we all" sharing our same similar experiences. If I follow your logic, unless its positive feedback, what, its supposedly bashing???

Bashing is a matter of perception. But since the organization in question has yielded many negative sentiments over a large diverse span of people, maybe then your perception of bashing is really nothing more than us discussing the flaws inherent in the system.

Furthermore, yes, bashing was weeks ago when I called the TSA a bunch of tools. There was an apology and all the discussions since have been discussions.


If I recall correctly, you did say "We are trying the best we can" only to state later, "the rest is just smoke and mirrors" Sorry but as an individual that loves science, I can see through the illusion.

If we are all spending $10 a roundtrip for better security, then we the consumer have a right to question the actions bestowed upon us. Unfortunately, your perception that we are all bashing the TSA is flawed.

As you stated your perception not mine. Don't like the "you" being used? Neither do I.

Paraphrasing the smoke and mirrors to the max I see.

"The TSA officer told this guy in a loud voice so everyone heard it" I believe this can be called projecting. :roll:

"Oh just wait to you read my article for Sunday! I provide my own brand of input on our friends at the TSA"

"I swear the TSA is Al Qaeda's best ally"

"Maybe the TSA could save the $$ by getting the big red/green button that some Central American countries use for security."

Yea, not bashing, right.

See you are jumping on policy issues which the people at the local airports have very little control over.

The TSA at the local airports do have control over what gets passed and what doesn't get past the checkpoints don't they? Gov't agency's that don't work have every right to be "Bashed" by the public as the public sees fit. Criticism and outrage for failed programs are a part of a free society and is our way of forcing change. I'll say it again blind Patriotism is the cancer of eternal vigilance. The TSA must change.

[emshighway]

When you all learn how to discuss then I will.


No one here is bashing the TSA. Note how you say when "you all learn".

So what, you think we are all bashing the TSA? Interesting how everyone seems to have nothing but the same negative sentiment. That is not bashing, that is "we all" sharing our same similar experiences. If I follow your logic, unless its positive feedback, what, its supposedly bashing???

Bashing is a matter of perception. But since the organization in question has yielded many negative sentiments over a large diverse span of people, maybe then your perception of bashing is really nothing more than us discussing the flaws inherent in the system.

Furthermore, yes, bashing was weeks ago when I called the TSA a bunch of tools. There was an apology and all the discussions since have been discussions.


If I recall correctly, you did say "We are trying the best we can" only to state later, "the rest is just smoke and mirrors" Sorry but as an individual that loves science, I can see through the illusion.

If we are all spending $10 a roundtrip for better security, then we the consumer have a right to question the actions bestowed upon us. Unfortunately, your perception that we are all bashing the TSA is flawed.

As you stated your perception not mine. Don't like the "you" being used? Neither do I.

Paraphrasing the smoke and mirrors to the max I see.

"The TSA officer told this guy in a loud voice so everyone heard it" I believe this can be called projecting. :roll:

"Oh just wait to you read my article for Sunday! I provide my own brand of input on our friends at the TSA"

"I swear the TSA is Al Qaeda's best ally"

"Maybe the TSA could save the $$ by getting the big red/green button that some Central American countries use for security."

Yea, not bashing, right.

See you are jumping on policy issues which the people at the local airports have very little control over.

The TSA at the local airports do have control over what gets passed and what doesn't get past the checkpoints don't they? Gov't agency's that don't work have every right to be "Bashed" by the public as the public sees fit. Criticism and outrage for failed programs are a part of a free society and is our way of forcing change. I'll say it again blind Patriotism is the cancer of eternal vigilance. The TSA must change.

You didn't link the patriotic music and free speech graphics.

"The TSA must change" don't disagree. Some federal agencies have had a hundred years to develop. The TSA is only five years old.

We have done the best we can to get up to speed to be as screwed up as the rest of the federal agencies. :twisted: (This will be the next comment to be paraphrased)

[mirrodie]

emshighway, perhaps you are beyond any reasonable discussion since the subject at hand is so personal to you.

As long as the TSA employees continue to screw up, the users will discuss these issues.


.....actually, no wait....

perhaps we need you to enlighten us all on what are clear boundaries between bashing and discussing.



My paraphrasing your remarks is nothing more than offering ideas and solutions to problems you highlighted. Yet when I parapharse them, it's bashing.


C'mon, now, let's be serious. How do you define bashing vs discussing.

I humbly await the working definitions

[markg]

When you all learn how to discuss then I will.


No one here is bashing the TSA. Note how you say when "you all learn".

So what, you think we are all bashing the TSA? Interesting how everyone seems to have nothing but the same negative sentiment. That is not bashing, that is "we all" sharing our same similar experiences. If I follow your logic, unless its positive feedback, what, its supposedly bashing???

Bashing is a matter of perception. But since the organization in question has yielded many negative sentiments over a large diverse span of people, maybe then your perception of bashing is really nothing more than us discussing the flaws inherent in the system.

Furthermore, yes, bashing was weeks ago when I called the TSA a bunch of tools. There was an apology and all the discussions since have been discussions.


If I recall correctly, you did say "We are trying the best we can" only to state later, "the rest is just smoke and mirrors" Sorry but as an individual that loves science, I can see through the illusion.

If we are all spending $10 a roundtrip for better security, then we the consumer have a right to question the actions bestowed upon us. Unfortunately, your perception that we are all bashing the TSA is flawed.

As you stated your perception not mine. Don't like the "you" being used? Neither do I.

Paraphrasing the smoke and mirrors to the max I see.

"The TSA officer told this guy in a loud voice so everyone heard it" I believe this can be called projecting. :roll:

"Oh just wait to you read my article for Sunday! I provide my own brand of input on our friends at the TSA"

"I swear the TSA is Al Qaeda's best ally"

"Maybe the TSA could save the $$ by getting the big red/green button that some Central American countries use for security."

Yea, not bashing, right.

See you are jumping on policy issues which the people at the local airports have very little control over.

I'm sorry I don't see how failing 90% of the spot checks is NOT an issue that local people have very little control over, unless you are saying that this happens all over the country, and it's just that the Star Ledger only got the Newark figures.

I don't call this bashing either. It's just a discussion about the inefficiency of a system, and how it is worse now than any time prior to 9/11. It's not a personal attack on you, it's a personal attack on all screeners who either can't or don't want to do the job for whatever reason. There may be some people who are so dilligent at the job that they have caught 100% of all contraband while on duty, but it's obvious that these people are in the minority rather than the majority.

[PhilDernerJr]

I think there are a lot of issues with national security in general that need to be addressed. Not to give leeway, but I can't expect a new organization to be born and kicking all ass 5 years later. On the other hand, I don't expect 90% failures, either.

And yes, as those failures are discovered, it NEEDS to be discussed here. I personally wouldn't say that the TSA is Al Qaeda's biggest ally, but there are some serious issues that need to be addressed and fixed or else we really do leave ourselves open to another large scale attack.

When it comes to consistency in confiscating/banning liquids and gels....I don't care about that, as I think the rule is pretty stupid anyway. If a screener in New HAmpshire takes away my Chap Stick and a screener in Dulles sees it and tells me that he uses the smae brand and lets me board with it....that realyl doesn't matter with national security. My concern is when explosive materials and so forth are passing through x-ray machines and other thigns that actually do present a danger.

As for the way the TSA rep spoke to the passenger who reached and didn't follow the sign, I honestly see no problem with that. I think every passenger that does that kind of thing should be sternly spoken to. I feel the rule is there for a reason.

It's a messy situation that needs fixing, and fast. I can only hope that somehow we manage to avoid another attack in this industry while the problems fix themselves.

[RDU-JFK]

Sternly spoken to is fine, heck even yelling. But being humiliated and degraded in front of dozens of travelers and using sarcasm on top of that is another story. Too many TSA employees, especially in the NYC airports have power trips but at the same time do not act in a professional way. Yelling and mocking at someone using sarcasm is one example, but that same day I was at LGA, the other security line had a woman sitting and joking around with a co-worker and talking about inappropriate things and using racial slurs, but more importantly not paying any attention to their jobs. This is really frightening to me, and I feel the problem lies in whom the TSA hires.

[T-Bird76]

As for the way the TSA rep spoke to the passenger who reached and didn't follow the sign, I honestly see no problem with that. I think every passenger that does that kind of thing should be sternly spoken to. I feel the rule is there for a reason.

Phil besides being in a security role these folks are in a customer service role as well. Every person who passes through their checkpoints is a customer of the TSA and a customer of the airlines. Why would you treat someone who perhaps doesn't know the rules or didn't see the sign in a rude fashion? As I said it could happen a million times a day but those are separate places in time with no connection to one and other. Each one of those passengers who are spoken to rudely share those stories with other passengers spreading the negative feelings about the TSA, you can't deny not. This is customer service 101. Now if you have one passenger reaching in a few times after being told not too politely then yes you can be stern but there is no reason that can justify being rude or humiliating people.

Btw there is no real danger from those X-ray machines; you would have to run yourself through 500 times to get any real dose of radiation.

[Matt Molnar]

A few years ago when I was unemployed I applied for a TSA screener job, but I ended up getting another job and never took the tests or anything. So it was awfully ironic given this conversation I'm in when I got this email from them today about a job opening:


1802-Transportation Security Officer (TSO) (Screener) – JFK006


Description

As a Transportation Security Officer (TSO) (Screener):

You will perform a variety of duties related to providing security and protection of air travelers, airports and aircraft. You will be responsible for identifying dangerous objects in baggage, cargo and/or on passengers; and preventing those objects from being transported onto aircraft. You are required to perform various tasks such as: wanding, pat down searches, operation of x-ray machines, lift and carry baggage (weighing up to 70 pounds), and screening and ticket review using electronic and imaging equipment. As a TSO , you may perform passenger screening, baggage screening or both. You are expected to perform these duties in a courteous and professional manner.

* Continuously and effectively interact with the public, giving directions and responding to inquiries in a reasonable tone and manner.
* Maintain focus and awareness within an environment containing numerous distractions, people, and noise.
* Stand and remain standing for periods up to 3 hours without sitting.
* Repeatly lift and carry an object weighing up to 70 pounds.
* Work within a stressful environment, which includes noise from alarms, machinery, and people, distractions, time pressure, disruptive and angry passengers, and the requirement to identify and locate potentially life-threatening devices and devices intended on creating massive destruction.
* Make effective decisions in both crisis and routine situations.


Work Schedule: Part-time (20-32) hours per week. Part-time work hours for this position consists of shift-work on any day from Sunday through Saturday which may include irregular hours, nights and week-end shifts, changing shifts, and split shifts. Specific work schedules will be determined by the airport.



TSA will not pay any pre-employment travel expenses (e.g., travel to and from testing, medical examination facilities and assessment sites). As part of the evaluation process you will be required to travel to a TSA specified medical facility within commuting area of the airport for which you applied.



Qualifications

1. You must be a U.S.Citizen or U.S. National; AND
2. You must have a high school diploma, GED or equivalent; OR at least one year of full-time work experience in security work, aviation screener work, or x-ray technician work.


In order to successfully perform this work, TSO’s must possess the following knowledge, skills, and abilities:

* English Proficiency (e.g., reading, writing, speaking, listening)
* Mental Abilities (e.g., visual observation and identification, mental rotation)
* Interpersonal Skills (e.g., customer service, dependability)
* Work Values (e.g., responsibility, honesty, integrity)
* Physical Abilities(e.g. repeatedly lifting and carrying baggage weighing up to 70 lbs, bending, reaching, stooping, squatting, standing, and walking and identifying objects by touch).



All TSO’s must meet the following standards:



* Distant vision correctable to 20/30 or better in the best eye and 20/100 or better in the worse eye
* Near vision correctable to 20/40 or better binocular
* Color perception (e.g., red, green, blue, yellow, orange, purple, brown, black, white, gray) note: color filters (e.g., contact lenses) for enhancing color discrimination are prohibited.
* Hearing as measured by audiometry cannot exceed: a) an average hearing loss of 25 decibels (ANSI) at 500, 1000, 2000 and 3000Hz in each ear, b) single reading of 45 decibels at 4000 Hz and 6000 Hz in each ear
* Adequate joint mobility, dexterity and range of motion, strength, and stability (to lift and move objects weighing up to 70 pounds), as well as a complete medical evaluation including cardiovascular system, hypertension, etc.


Conditions of Employment:

To be considered for employment, you must be able to:

* demonstrate daily a fitness for duty without impairment due to illegal drugs, sleep deprivation, medication, or alcohol;
* work all of the following: irregular hours and/or shifts, including split-shifts; holidays and weekends; overtime; and extended hours;
* pass a Drug and Alcohol Screening; and
* pass a background investigation, including a criminal check and a credit check.

In addition, you must successfully complete required training, which includes: 56-72 hours of classroom training, 112-128 hours of on-the-job training, and a certification examination.

Continued employment is contingent upon passing recurrent training and certification exams on a periodic basis.

This is a non-critical sensitive National Security position that requires you to be fingerprinted, photographed, and complete appropriate security paperwork, including a SF-86, Questionnaire for National Security Positions. If your credit check reveals that you have defaulted on $5,000 or more in debt (excluding certain circumstances of bankruptcy), owe any delinquent Federal or State taxes, or owe any past due child support payments, you will not be eligible for this position.

TSA is an Equal Opportunity Employer. Qualified applicants will receive consideration without regard to non-merit factors as race, color, religion, gender, handicap, age, sexual orientation, national origin, political affiliation, marital status, non-disqualifying disabilities, membership or non-membership in an employee organization, personal favoritism, protected genetic information, or status as a parent. TSA does have requirements to provide same-gender screening to travelers to protect their privacy.

If you are a qualified candidate with a disability and you wish to request a reasonable accommodation under the Rehabilitation Act (the federal governments version of the Americans with Disabilities Act), you may download the appropriate forms at https://tsacareers.taleo.net/accommodation/ or you may call the TSA Recruitment Center at 1-800-887-1895 or TTY 1-800-887-5506.

Profile
Job Field 1802-Officer
Locations NY-New York-JFK - John F. Kennedy
Schedule Part-time
Employee Status (Regular refers to Permanent) Regular

Additional Information
Opening Date November 2, 2006
Closing Date November 30, 2006

Pay Band (Does not include locality pay) D - Minimum $23,600 - Maximum $35,400

[emshighway]

I see you joined FlyerTalk Tommy. Have fun.